Good Goodbye / Craven vs. Elizabeth

Good Goodbye / Craven vs. Elizabeth

Good Goodbye — Craven vs. Elizabeth

by Cab

This comic has not been rated; viewer discretion advised.

Icon for Craven46.7%
226 points
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Crit level: No preference
tags: craven, elizabeth

by Flytee

This comic has not been rated; viewer discretion advised.

Icon for Elizabeth 53.3%
258 points
Page 1Page 2Page 3Page 4Page 5Page 6Page 7Page 8Page 9Page 10Page 11Page 12Page 13Page 14Page 15Page 16Page 17Page 18Page 19Page 20

Crit level: No preference

Critiques & Comments
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# 7   Posted: Nov 23 2019, 01:22 PM
kinda late, but I just wanted to thank everyone who commented and voted. The feedback here was super helpful, particularly all the stuff about body language and making things more fluid... I'll work on that!

I was also confused as to why Elizabeth was drawn to her own body in the morgue when she said she’d sensed Catherine’s energy, and why we should recognise her without her mask on?  

the idea was that the "pull" Elizabeth sensed was always leading her to her own body, but because she is delusional she assumed it was taking her to Catherine.
I thought it would be interesting to play up her religious zealousness in this way- she interrupts everything as the Cycle helping or leading her to the best possible outcome. (Her reaction to the morgue doors opening in another example of this). I'm sorry it ended up kinda confusing!

As for why the reader should recognise Elizabeth's maskless body... I'd hoped the hair would give it away as well as Talon stating that they had her body. Again, sorry it ended up being confusing.

# 6   Posted: Nov 19 2019, 02:57 PM
oof this a very late and simple comment but i'm making it

cab: as always, some very nice detail and technical skill just about everywhere! a little disappointed that your line width epiphany doesn't really show up in this. it's also very obvious you scaled around a lot of stuff instead of redrawing it, with totally disparate line clarity between panels. i gotta get picky about this because you've been so dang consistent over you past five trillion comics :v this conflict seems real forced, like, the whole idea of the cycle is that she or anyone else is supposed to die, right? i can't really believe that elizabeth would see it as abandonment, that's the point! she's upset about her death in flytee's comic too, but her faith enables her to reconcile it, it doesn't push her away from it.  i guess that's just in how you interpreted what little source you have on this site, but having also written elizabeth, it just felt so alien, i guess :v

flytee: i don't have as many words for you, i just really enjoyed this! very cute, very funny, also very satisfying to have closure to someone's arc for once on this website :v this is also like the second high quality friendship you've built with your characters, i'm really digging how you write them.

# 5   Posted: Nov 13 2019, 11:27 AM
You both did a wonderful job with your comics!

Cab: I feel your lines are a lot more cleaner now, but there's some panels where the quality seems to drop, like if you scaled a small drawing to fit the panel. As an exemple, one of the onomatopeia you used, the "ka-chuk" from page 3 just feels out of place due to the blurriness (and also sudden colorfulness) of it.
And like arts said already, i really wanted to see some expressions on Dario like you were able to do with Elizabeth's mask.
But all crits aside, you came up with a really nice plot, it was funny, sad and had a wholesome ending (the bird on the shoulder of the statue was a nice touch *cries*)

Flytee: I love how you come up with these creative storylines and manage to give them continuation in other battles, and in this case an ending. I feel the pacing was flawless in this, it didn't felt rushed nor slow, and when i realized that was actually her body it gave me real chills :')
I think there's just a little lack of body expression in your characters, they seem so stiff in some panels. Maybe practice adding some exageration/fluidity to their gestures, this way they may come out more natural and believable in their expression ;)

Anyway! both of your stories were so GOOD!! and by the end of them i got a little emotional after hearing the song Cab suggested in the comments.
mmmm the feels... (i'm adding these to my favorites playlist now *sobs*)

# 4   Posted: Nov 13 2019, 12:10 AM
Did you both decide on a story and then do your own interpretations? Because in both Elizabeth tries to find Catherine, realised she’s dead, threatens Craven and Dario.. and even says the same line of “is this a sick joke”. If that’s a coincidence that’s freaking amazing. In any case, it was super interesting to see how your comics differed, especially with the endings!

Cab - Am I sensing some easing up on the details? Because this comic was much easier for me to read than some of your previous ones! This was a sweet story, I have to admit Craven is starting to grow on me. I liked the detail at the end of Catherine’s statue going from scowling during her first appearance, to smiling at the end with the bird on her shoulder.

I agree with Arts in that I’m starting to notice the shortcuts more and more. Especially copy pasted Dario and not fully coloured in Craven. I’m not sure if you read the comments or not to be honest, because I see at least one person commenting on blurriness, excessive copy paste or line thickness/colour on each new comic you put out, but not much difference in the following comics. I also think this comic had pacing issues - on page 4 Elizabeth destroys Cathy’s head and then in the very next panel she’s apologising and saying she lost her head. Give her some time to cool down and come to her senses!

Flytee - “These normies are useless to me!” got a snort from me irl. You managed to take this comic from sweet and somewhat funny to sad very smoothly, I barely noticed the transition till I got hit with Craven feels :”) I like how you used Craven’s “visual speak” and amped up the number of speech bubbles when he was frantic, they conveyed his mood very well along with the cute emotes. Also enjoyed how you weaved Garland and Talon in!

Not to take away the fact that you managed another 20 pages for this battle (wow!) but.. I feel in this case it didn’t work out well. I felt like the story dragged on and could have been cut shorter, while the ending felt abrupt (though I understand this was due to time issues). Some of Craven’s bubbles, while cute, were not entirely clear to me (e.g. page 4 panel 2). I was also confused as to why Elizabeth was drawn to her own body in the morgue when she said she’d sensed Catherine’s energy, and why we should recognise her without her mask on?  

Community Manager
# 3   Posted: Nov 12 2019, 11:04 PM
Cab: I only just realized it on like my second read through but  that ending is really sweet with the bird and the smiling statue. It's also nice to see a story just focusing on the two characters without any major brand new npcs taking up the spotlight.  That being said you should slow down your pace to do some quality control on the pages as there are some issues that are starting to show up more that can be avoided if you slow down and do a relook at all the panels to make sure they're consistent. The biggest example I can think of is in this comic Elizabeth's staff keeps disappearing and reappearing which is something that can be avoided if when you finish all the panels on a page you go back through it to make sure all the elements are consistent.

If you're going to reuse a panel or image make sure to start with the biggest version first then resize to the smaller ones. there are some panels here where you zoomed in and enlarged redrawing and made those panels look blurry. you could also just redo the panel after resizing it if you time, either way you should work more to avoid the blurry effect that happens when you resize them.

Since in your comic you brought up Eliabeth having a mask but still emoting with said mask, it makes it weird that Dario's skull doesn't emote at all. When one object like a mask is emoting you should try to make it consistent with the other ones like Dario's skull.
All that being said good job with this comic and your consistency at production is still something to be looked up to and aim for.

Flytee: Thank you for the Garland cameo i love what you did with him and how you drew him, now that her troubledspirit is all taken care of she will make a great doll : )

This was a great comic from start to finish, also i just noticed did you change your handwriting to make your own custom font? the word bubbles in this look great here (great meaning i didn't notice them which is what most word bubbles should aim for). Honestly i just really like most everything about this comic.

the only crit i have is that in the later parts you should have used some more body language to properly convey Elizabeths emotions. Particularly once it gets to the morgue and you have some close up shots of her mask , the last panel on page 15 being the one that stuck out to me the most. it would have sold her desperate emotions had we seen some more of her body language or even just her head tilted slightly showing something slightly snapped. also later when she's resigned her fate the body language could have been pushed more to show it.

I love Elizabeth and this was such a nice and sad sendoff for her for this month of the dead. but Garland will take great care of her : )

# 2   Posted: Nov 10 2019, 09:49 PM
Phew I too barely got this finished in time as well, I had a bit of Laptop problems and I started a new job but I'll be damned not to miss my chance at working with your great character, Elizabeth.
 I really enjoyed this script, and I hope you enjoy it.

(Ps. this is meant to take place after the Tag Team Magical Girl Death Tournament, Round 2 — Scout and Boris vs. Catherine and Elizabeth, also after the final page please listen to this song as a unofficial end credits song -->  

# 1   Posted: Nov 10 2019, 07:54 AM
phew I barely got this finished in time!
I was pretty busy with life stuff during this battle, as a result I had to simplify my tonal colouring and trim down some of the scenes...particularly at the end.
Hopefully, this comic still works as a coherent story.

thanks so much for the challenge Cab, I had a lot of fun writing Craven and Dario/ having them get swept along on this messed up journey.

(PS This is a follow up to "Living meat" Elizabeth vs Tyidid- I'd recommend reading that first if you haven't!)

Comic Details -

Drawing Time: 3 weeks
Ended: Nov 18th, 2019
Votes Cast: 11
Page Views: 1119
Winner: Flytee

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