Zhanic Hanalei vs. Drednaut

Zhanic Hanalei vs. Drednaut

Zhanic Hanalei vs. Drednaut

392 points
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Crit level: Open to any comments or critiques
tags: drednaut, mild gore, the black market, zhanic, zhanic hanalei

by drawdan

421 points
Page 1Page 2Page 3Page 4Page 5Page 6Page 7Page 8Page 9

Crit level: Open to any comments or critiques

Critiques & Comments
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# 15   Posted: Oct 23 2019, 10:59 AM
Thank you everyone who commented, and thank you again Drawdan for the battle! Congrats on winning :3

Dan: it was really cool seeing Zhanic in your style, and that panel with Zhanic pulling back the arrow was SO COOL. And man, that panel with the other orc getting sliced in half was absolutely brutal, it was rad. Also, I know it's a small detail, but I actually really loved the idea of the thorn rubies? They're so cool :U I'm very much looking forward to where Dreds' story goes, and I hope he gets brought back to the good side soon asdlkghasdf

@Heathen: You're totally right, I could definitely do more with interesting camera angles. There were actually a few panels I reworked from the original sketches to give some more interesting angles, but I definitely could have used that even more. I'll try working on that in future comics!!

@Flytee & Rivana: Ah, yeah, I definitely should've added at least some more gray scales on the prison bgs. I considered it, but decided against it cuz I wanted the prison to have the feeling of a stark, sterile environment--but I think I went a bit too far with that, lol. Backgrounds are definitely the thing I struggle most with, so they're definitely the thing I need to work on the most.

@Cy: Ahhh, yeah, the amount of panels was definitely an issue I was aware could be a problem. I decided to go ahead with it anyways to see if it'd work, but apparently it didn't. It was worth a shot at least, so thank u for letting me know it didn't work as intended lol. Probably should've gone with fewer panels per page and more pages.

@Flutter: Admittedly, having Zhanic be rather passive was a bit of an intentional choice, since at this point in his story he's still just kind of going along with whatever occurs around him, but I think from here on out I'll work on making him be a bit more proactive. I actually had a different idea originally that was more active for both of them, but cut it out because it seemed too much for me to do--next time, I'll definitely think twice about that, haha.

@everyone: thank you all again for commenting, it's a lot to take in and I'll definitely be working on improving the areas that I need to and keeping the elements I did well :D

# 14   Posted: Oct 22 2019, 03:20 PM
HeavenBat- wow I love the scar you gave Dred on this. Very creative and I never in a million years would've come up with that idea. Page 2 is my fave too and I wish you did the same shading on the rest of the pages, especially 3 and 4. They looked kinda bare/unfinished compared to the rest of the comic.  I also really dig the way you used Ghost here and showed us this underground world of trafficking. It just totally made sense that Ghost would be a part of it and I hope that it is something others can expand upon in their battles. I certainly took note of it!

Drawdan -  Ah nothing like seeing Void's superhero group working together again! As an old school comic reader myself, I really  appreciate this and the nostalgic feeling it gives me. I like that you used higher contrast this time and the detail you put into Arena's tattoo was impressive. I had a kick seeing Zhanic in your style. It so easy to forget he is a troll sometimes because of stylistic choices but the realism here really hit it home for me. I just wish there was more interaction between Zhanic and Dreds. I do like that you also used this battle to further Dred's story. I can't wait to see him reunited with Swan and the gang.

# 13   Posted: Oct 21 2019, 06:53 AM
@Heavenbat: This was very creative. Despite this being a scar match, Zhanic and Drednaut wound up becoming allies. There were nice touches of color here and there like that green part of the ceiling on page 2.

@Drawdan: I like your inks and the even the penciled pages at the end were high quality and had a nice texture to them.  Good job on setting up an ambitious plot with such different characters.

# 12   Posted: Oct 20 2019, 02:01 PM
Heavenbat: I'm going to echo that Zhanic was pretty passive in this story. Even how he wound up there was passive, being approached by Ghost while he's just relaxing. I liked Zhanic's hopeful attitude and flexibility (I wonder if this will be an asset in future adventures), but the events of this story could have happened without him there. And, TBH, Drednaut is pretty passive, too, simply taking a moment to flex his ability to not be controlled. I think, too, your panels are a little small where the action needs more oomph and importance, like shooting through the guard.

Drawdan: I do like that rough, hand drawn feel. I feel like here, too, the main characters come off as passive. Granted, you are working on a bigger overarching story involving many characters, but the actual involvement of Zhanic and Drednaut comes off as incidental, especially when the emotional impact was negated so quickly at the end. (Ah... pity to have a typo during a key moment like the death of one's presumed brother. I know typos are hard to catch, but it does take away when it's in a place like that)

# 11   Posted: Oct 19 2019, 03:03 PM
Wow, also alot to process.
I certainly did not intend to trivialize Z, and I did include the reveal that the dead orc was not his brother so that HB can evolve that story on his own terms. I certainly dont discount your perspective and always value crits. No hurt feelings. I will make an effort in future battles to shift the importance of my opponents character more heavily over what is going on in Dreds continuing story. My idea of making Dreds under the control of a new villain was supposed to play out over several battles but I see your point of spending to much page time on the search and rescue.

Community Manager
# 10   Posted: Oct 19 2019, 01:38 PM
Bat: this was a cool interaction and I love the scars you have been giving people in your matches, they're pretty creative and distinct, also the way they get the scars is also entertaining as it's not just from the two characters directly fighting each other. other's have mentioned the backgrounds but that's just something you will learn as you do more, and having written and storyboarded the collab we're working on i know you will be getting some intense background practice. For backgrounds the more elements you add the less you have to worry about the individual neatness of each item, but they do need to follow a perspective and that is something that can be a pain to practice. so maybe try practicing some perspective shots and fleshing out some backgrounds.

Drawdan: I love your retro style and how even the pencils do look complete. However, I frankly hate this story. This sidelines zhanic and his characterization to continue the plot you had mandated before he was involved and it feels like he was shoved in.

the plot is Dreadnaught's allies try to find him and he goes on his first mission under mind control and comes across Zhanic who when hospitalized provides a lead for his allies. this comic focuses too much on the plot and ignores the emotions and character development, which are generally way keep a reader interested in a story.

Also a minor art aside, You can push some of your emotions more, like on page 3 panel 3 Jane in her dialogue shows frustration but her face is completely flat, without that dialogue we would have no idea what's going on or how she feels, the art should let us know how the character is feeling with the text letting us know the context.

There is also a disproportionate time spent on the build up. I know you mentioned you had to cut down on some places and I think at least part of that was in the wrong places. Page 2 adds nothing, the plot in page two is rehashed by Arena's dialogue in page 3. The emotion of the page is not enough to validate it staying either, maybe if Arena was visibly struggling to keep her cool showing how serious a toll this search is taking on her, this page would have it's worth. but to push it far enough to show those emotions would sideline Zhanic even more than he already is.

Speaking of Zhanic the biggest story flaw is not that Zhanic is storylined, I think you could make a story work with him just being a bit character in it, but Zhanic is  not only a minor character his emotions and characterization are both largely ignored. When Zhanic has even less of a role in the comic the impact he needs to have in it needs to be bigger. Since the impact he has isn't by what he does for this story he needs to have a huge emotional impact for the story when he's here.  He is finally meeting one of his blood siblings and is achieving the goal he meant to set out on for his journey, and then it is taken away from him in one of the quickest and cruelest ways possible. This is a huge fucking deal and needs to be shown as such with Zhanic losing any sort of composure for the rest of the comic showing it through his dialogue, body language, and expressions. Zhanic is your opponent and he needs to have some kind of huge impact and going with the story you told he needs to be a victim and we need to feel his hurt.

The whole reason i started to hate this story was the ending line "by the way, that orc wasn't your brother". To not fully capture the severity of the situation and not being able to fully capture Zhanic's trauma is understandable since he's not your character. But you not only ignore it, you throw it away as quickly as you bring it up with this one line. This just makes it all a huge waste, maybe you didn't want to do something too severe for your opponents character, but by playing it safe you completely trivialize the whole situation and lessen any impact that happened. It is also all trivialized so you can move onto the next plot element. When you sacrifice so much characterization and emotion to just move onto to the next plot element, what is there left for the reader to care about the plot?

Finally lessening the impact of this happening to Zhanic also lessens the severity of what Dreadnaut is doing. the reader knows about Zhanic and most people here on Void have seen so we know him. The more painful Dreadnauts actions are to Zhanic the more we care for Zhanic and the more we want Dreadnaut to stop being forced to do terrible things and the more we root for his allies finding him sooner. By the end of this comic Zhanic seems pretty fine in the hospital and some rando got killed, we don't have such a sense of urgency. But if Zhanic was completely traumatized and broken down not only would this focused on your opponents character it would also create a bigger sense of urgency and hook for the reader for the plot.

I hope this long triad is helpful and doesn't discourage. I did hate this comic because of the story. But I like your stuff and really want to see you continue and make better stories with a stronger impact.

# 9   Posted: Oct 18 2019, 05:32 AM
Cydork, Yea I caught the missed lisp to late unfortunately. I felt like it was reasonable to jump to anger  when the guy he  thought was his brother was killed  because 1. He’s an Orc, and 2. His  background info said he was impulsive .  As far as the chipped tooth, goes, I went with that because I thought it would be a cool look for an Orc, thats all. Seems several people are taking issue with it. Dreds also delivers a fairly deep cut across Z’s chest and upper arm . If Heavenbat ends up loosing this bout and wants to use that scar and get his tooth fixed, I’m sure that would meet the qualification for the match.  Sorry its my first Scar Match so maybe I should have given the type of injury some more consideration. I did have another couple of pages of fighting scripted but ran short on time and didn’t want to sacrifice the quality of the whole comic for a few rushed pages.

As always, thx for taking the time to give me a critical- they are always appreciated.

Fly tee- I totally agree with your Crits, this was scripted as a  12 page comic  but when I ran short on time I had to make some edits to the overall story’s detriment unfortunately, but I agree.
Thx for the input.

# 8   Posted: Oct 18 2019, 02:29 AM
Heathen and Flytee said most of it, really, but I still have a couple of thoughts.

Bat - Zhanic is Baby. I don’t really have anything to say beyond the fact that I like seeing him wander around and enjoyed his jail convo with Drednaut lol. The scar was also wicked and earned an extra creativity point from me.

However I notice you pack a lot of panels per page in this battle. As a result everything looks kind of cramped and the text is too small, I often had to zoom in a lot more than usual to read it. And I know people have mentioned the backgrounds but I feel even making Zhanic all grey instead of white on page 2 (as well as making all the backgrounds set inside the club darker) would have helped with atmosphere a lot.

Drawdan - Your spot blacks are great and I love the way you draw eyes. I also thought the last page was a nice touch - the story could have ended with Zhanic just getting bashed but you add the interaction and cheer up his day a little, which I liked.

Apart from what others have mentioned, I feel like you sacrificed some of Zhanic’s character to tell this story. It seems strange to me that he immediately reacts with anger and attempting to attack Drednaut, and doesn’t even flinch when his supposed brother is sliced in HALF in front of him. He also lacks his signature lisp. Finally the tusk breaking seems a bit.. off to me? Zhanic appears to have been whacked pretty hard, I’d expect some more damage around the face, and the impact is way above the actual tooth, so it appears to have broken off by its own accord.

# 7   Posted: Oct 17 2019, 10:59 AM
Batty- Zhanic is such a cinnamon roll, I REALLY hope he learns from this experience and becomes a bit more careful...and maybe develops some animosity towards ghost? It felt like a cool set up for some juicy storytelling.
Drednaut came across really cool here, and the two characters bounced off each other pretty well! Good job there.
Art wise I can see some improvement here, I particularly enjoyed page 2 and your use of greys to add a bit more depth to the background. The stained glass skyline was a nice touch too. For future comics, I'd loved to see this level of attention to backgrounds through out your comic. I'm just really not of fan of so many stark white backgrounds.

Drawdan- you handled all the extra characters really well, it didn't feel awkward at all and flowed nicely, however, I would've traded that for more Zhanic screen time. The missing brother aspect of this story could've been fleshed out a lot more, giving the death of the orc more impact and allowing Zhanic to feel less like a spare part in this story.
Slightly nit-picky, story crits aside, this was a fun comic, your drawing skills are enviable and you manage to create a gritty old school comic vibe. Great job

# 6   Posted: Oct 16 2019, 10:48 AM
Wow, alot of information to process but very helpful crit Heathen. Thx

# 5   Posted: Oct 16 2019, 10:06 AM
Heavenbat: I like the encounter you've done here. Ghost's inclusion felt a little forced, you definitely could have made his role of getting Zhanic to the meta traffickers club a bit less incidental by having Zhanic seek him out. Zhanic lacks agency, being gotten into and out of trouble by other characters. The daydreaming innocent is a common trope in void comics, and it just isn't interesting in an action story. I do like your clarity, so good job there, that's the most important thing, so you've done your job. Now I'd like to see you punch up the drama by using birdseye and worms eye views and placing your "camera" in more interesting locations to lend more depth and story to your panels. You come close with the panel of Dreadnaut shouting as the nanites activate.

Dan: Great work finishing this comic, even the pencils are complete. Your faces seem to be your strongest feature, but your bodies vary wildly. I think Dreadnaut's meant to be a big dude, but on pages 7 and especially 8, he's got a very slender waist and just doesn't look impressive. I love your old school American comics style, and I'd like to see you push your figures more. If a guy's big, make him huge! Give us camera angles that emphasize and exaggerate his size. Don't just have him standing there, have him towering over us! Also, you've got some real bad fists flying on page 1. Knowing what your faces look like, I expect much more from your hands.

Interestingly, you also prominently feature other characters that almost overshadow your opponent. I think you pull it off okay, but I would have liked to see the focus firmly on Zhanic, since he's cast as the protagonist here. When Drednaut finally shows up, he doesn't disappoint.

Minor clarity note: 1.1 and 1.2, we have a VO saying they have someone in sight,  but we can't clearly see the target. Show us what we have in sight. Then in panel 2, the guy on the ground is visible, but the leaping figure is in silhouette, whom we quickly find out is arena. Since the distant figure in panel 1 and the leaping figure in panel 2 are both rendered as a featureless black figure,  they read as the same thing. Only after a moment do you realize what's going on. In panel 1, the thug should be clearly lit, and we should see a silhouette of Arena perched on the roof where our view is from. That way we immediately recognize in panel 2 that our view has flipped and the thug in the foreground is the thug we were looking at, and the shadowy attacker is the shadow we were just sitting next to on the roof.

Also on clarity, your reading order on page 6 is ruined by the tangents created by the building appearing to be panel gutters, and the balloon in panel 2 breaking into panel 1. I at first read from balloon 1 to balloon 4, 5, then realized I'd skipped half of panel 1.

Finally, I kinda wanted to know who Dreadnaut's target was. I like the fake out, but we never found out why that guy was important. I love how he was dispatched, but after the wonderfully violent depiction of his killing, a chipped tooth came off as kind of a lame scar.

We need to battle, Dan.

# 4   Posted: Oct 15 2019, 11:58 PM
Submitted, Thx again for the challenge. Fun doing a scar match and drawing your Orc. Looking forward to seeing your art.

# 3   Posted: Oct 15 2019, 01:27 AM
I won't have much time tomorrow to work on it, so I went ahead and submitted now :D Thanks again Drawdan for accepting, I had a blast working with Drednaut. I also had a lot of fun coming up with a scar for him--I had a few ideas bouncing around and I'm honestly sad I had to settle on just one, haha.

I wanted to get this more colored, but these past four weeks have been a real struggle with focus. There are definitely still some issues I'm well aware of, but overall I'm fairly satisfied with what I was able to do.

seriously though it's an honor to have fought such an old character, even more so to be his first scar match. :D

# 2   Posted: Oct 10 2019, 02:49 PM
Drawdan yesssss!

# 1   Posted: Sep 19 2019, 01:07 PM
ive never done a scar match before, thx for the challenge. Should be fun.

Comic Details -

Type: Scar Match
Drawing Time: 4 weeks
Ended: Oct 22nd, 2019
Votes Cast: 21
Page Views: 703
Winner: drawdan

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