tommy vs. Chia-Hui

tommy vs. Chia-Hui

tommy vs. Chia-Hui

by mvm

51.6%
541 points
Page 1Page 2Page 3Page 4Page 5

Crit level: No preference

by carlito

48.4%
507 points
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Crit level: No preference



Critiques & Comments
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Mister Kent
Artist
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944 comments
# 66   Posted: May 14 2011, 06:01 PM
Nice first battle, mvm! I liked your characters, especially that badass bear. Next time, I'd like to see cleaner lines, but keep expanding on that storyline.

Carlito, your comic actually had some nice panels, but the pacing seemed all off due to your choice to have 1 panel per page. The lines were also rough, but I know you can make beautiful smooth lines, and have done so before.

jho
Artist
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485 comments
# 65   Posted: May 13 2011, 10:40 AM
yeeesh carlito, what the fuck.

Ten Dead Kings
Artist
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269 comments
# 64   Posted: May 12 2011, 08:16 PM
Double post :awesomeface:

      Edited May 12 2011,  08:16 PM by Ten Dead Kings

Ten Dead Kings
Artist
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269 comments
# 63   Posted: May 12 2011, 08:15 PM
Y'all postin' in a bad thread

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x120/RenditionMission/blogs/picard-fp-ascii.gif

Really Carlito, I lost to you?

Coatl
Artist
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318 comments
# 62   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:46 PM
kuro: Seriously.
What's next?
Are you actually mvm in disguise?
OH SNAP GAMECHANGER!
Quote

fuck nigga, that's a bigger twist than M.night!


Kuro
Artist
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581 comments
# 61   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:44 PM
Seriously.
What's next?
Are you actually mvm in disguise?
OH SNAP GAMECHANGER!

Kuro
Artist
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581 comments
# 60   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:41 PM
After all this? Now? Now you come forward with the earth shattering revelation that you inked his page? Really?

BUT CARLITO! WHERE DID YOU FIND THE TIME, WHAT WITH YOUR EPIC TWENTY PAGE BATTLE & ALL?!?!

Cracking Skulls
Global Moderator
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344 comments
# 59   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:37 PM
Not like you never cheated, Carlito...

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 58   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:36 PM
You speak a lot of truth Mr No. My fault for being a jerk once again. Peace.

      Edited May 12 2011,  07:44 PM by carlito

Darius Corry
Artist
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427 comments
# 57   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:35 PM
Dang Carlito, you leaving for real? You said we could do another battle.

Real talk dude, just do your work. You're free to draw how you want, but you have to understand YOU WILL NOT WIN EVERYONE OVER. I do understand criticism can be slightly hurtful and the lack of commenting while votes continue to SLAUGHTER can be even more frustrating, but at the end of the day... Chai is your character and you draw him as you please. You're not being charged to be here, nor are you being sanctioned for losing.... but only availing yourself to react freely. This monk has the capacity to be the BEST dude on the site to you even if he lost EVERY battle and never finished a battle ever, so don't let anyone deny you of continuing on the site.

I will say that you're also better than bringing other people down, dude. I've to see a perfect artist on this site, yet none of us has the prowess to bring down another artist. Let's remain constructive, dont have to, but cmon dude.

K im done.

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 56   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:30 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:34 AM by carlito

Fox24
Artist
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215 comments
# 55   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:27 PM
Carlito Quinones: Fox24  Angie actually told me to ASK you what my scar should be hahahahahaha I kept the email.
Quote

you want a scar, COOL! You chose the wrong time to ask for one buddy. first, Lou, Loo, Lucy, whatever your guys name is was giving scars in our fight, which he's not even an official character so yea, shut up there. Two I should scar carlito's tear glands because well your doing WAY to much crying, but instead I'll scar something simple. I cut out carlito's tongue, and feed it to his sheep and then his sheep dies from eating raw meat. talked to angie and she said it's fine pish posh. So hey there ya go buddy enjoy.

Coatl
Artist
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318 comments
# 54   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:15 PM
wait you inked over his page even though someone else was inking over the page and you call him out on cheating as if that doesn't make you look bad especially since you admitted to helping him cheat?

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 53   Posted: May 12 2011, 07:09 PM
Fox24 haha you didn't even do a scar man! If you had I wouldn't even have cried about it. The first rule in the scar match rules was you must scar your opponent. That's over with though and I could care less cause even though it was against the rules for you to win that I didn't get a scar. You won! But I got no scar! How does that even make sense?! Angie actually told me to ASK you what my scar should be hahahahahaha I kept the email. Yeah everybody, I'm the jerk and there is no crooked stuff happening on Void besides me! Say hello to the bad guy!

carlito
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375 comments
# 52   Posted: May 12 2011, 06:58 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:36 AM by carlito

Fox24
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215 comments
# 51   Posted: May 12 2011, 06:56 PM
Carlito Quinones: I myself often took on people I thought don't write very well or that artistically I thought I could beat, like Fox24
Quote


Welp I stayed out of it as long as I could. Thank you Carlito for proving to the world your a DICK for one. For two, you write better than me, heh. I Scoff because I look at my win column and again I see two wins donated by who else, the master writer Carlito. And my man MVM, I have to apologize because well things like this happen often with this guy. So if you win, congratulations you now have a enemy for life. OH! and another thing, if you fight him in a scar match and WIN, he'll just ignore it and write his own stuff. So while you waltz over to victory and Carlito continues to cry and weap about Oh my scores are low where are my friends, or the even better one YOUR ALL WRONG AND I SHOULD BE WINNING, just take solace in the fact you did a good job and everyone looks forward to your next work. Oh and carlito man those two wins you gave me sure do taste sweet, keep up the good oscar award winning whine fest you have going. Looks good on ya.

Qyzex
Artist
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670 comments
# 50   Posted: May 12 2011, 06:44 PM
Check out this hornses ass

Coatl
Artist
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318 comments
# 49   Posted: May 12 2011, 05:52 PM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT THOSE BATTLES BRO!

I TOLD YOU DOG

Coatl
Artist
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318 comments
# 48   Posted: May 12 2011, 05:52 PM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT THOSE BATTLES BRO!

I TOLD YOU DOG

Coatl
Artist
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318 comments
# 47   Posted: May 12 2011, 05:52 PM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT THOSE BATTLES BRO!

I TOLD YOU DOG

Cracking Skulls
Global Moderator
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344 comments
# 46   Posted: May 12 2011, 04:51 PM
Kuro, you're a bro to me forever.

Kuro
Artist
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581 comments
# 45   Posted: May 12 2011, 04:10 PM
mvm, listen, I'm really sorry all this shit went down over the course of this. it's just Carlito's way (heh...... kill me). as far as your comic, you're squeezing a lot of panels onto each of your pages. We're not feeling a lot of the stark impacts because they're squished into tiny panels. Give actions room to breathe & take effect. And don't be afraid to spread information out over onto more pages either.

You also want to remember to keep in mind the way the eyes move across a page. Left to right, then down. There are some places in this (notably the first page with the bear's close up & the caption underneath that read a little funny & cause me to check where I'm supposed to go next. The process of me checking takes me out of a story, if even for a second & kills any pace you were starting to build. That's why as cliche as the rectangular panels can be, they work the best.

now the implementing color was good, but the way you scanned those pages was different & it made the pages look different. my suggestion is to scan your whole comic as color images & then crush the black areas (using "levels" in photoshop) so we don't see marker/brush strokes in the black. It looks the slickest that way & the edges tend to stay nice & smooth.

the end started to look a little rushed too. otherwise this is a pretty ok first showing. Hope this debacle doesn't ruin your experience & that you keep on battling now that you've started.



ok....

First of all, I just want to have a good chuckle at:

Carlito Quinones: I myself often took on people I thought don't write very well or that artistically I thought I could beat, like Fox24
Quote

Carlito Quinones: I don't care about wins
Quote

So is that why you rush out these haphazard battles so quickly one after another, & like that tobias battle, just kind of skirt the bare minimum of what's required from you? If that's the case, it's really funny; frankly it's pretty hilarious that your underestimation of your opponent came back to bite you in your Opportunistic ass so many times, this battle included.

Why did the voting shock you so much initially? Even if you're just basing it off what your opponent did, you're not putting time or effort into these things, & mvm did a much more solid comic here. Why the confusion? Because you "had more pages?" (and this is where I segue into an admittedly rather savage critique)

Question: Did you draw these on post-it notes?

I ask because you started a post-it note jam not to long ago (which, I'll give you, good idea... for a jam), and all of these "SPLASH" panels are the same square-ish dimensions, with lines that look quite large in relation to the page. If in fact you did? Novel idea. There's certainly no parameters governing what your pages can & can't be on, & there's  potential for it to turn out in a really cool way. This, however, is miles from that really cool way. As, this is in fact, ATROCIOUS.

You're drawing too small for whatever thickness implement your using & it makes your lines look way too thick & way too sloppy. I mean it's neat to sometimes see imperfections & things in the line, but this seriously looks like you drew it with one of those old silly wax pencils. And you know what, even if this isn't wax pencil on post-it note, it really might as well be because that's precisely what this looks like. It's rushed & trashy. Beyond that, it takes place pretty much in an utter vacuum. There's no frame of reference for what's happening because there's not only no establishing shot, there's no backgrounds. The fact that this is just characters interacting in oblivion shows little thought or energy on your part to make this story actually mean anything. At all.

Now, Splash pages. Invoke the name of Kirby all you want, splash pages are USED FOR A REASON. They can introduce a story, establish something elaborate, or hammer home something impactful. It's an effect. But using that same effect over & over & over again serves absolutely no purpose other than to annoy your audience. There's no real reason for this story to be told as it is. Fuck, even if I'm right about the post-it thing, you can still split them shits into panels. This is shoddy storytelling murdered my gimmicky pacing. You'd think after three years you would've been able to pick up something about how to tell a story properly.

Couple the lack of effort on the art with the gimmick of single panel pages & what you got is a perfect storm of bullshit. you're dragging out maybe 5 pages worth of shit over a grueling 20. There's a right & wrong way to tell a story. This is certainly wrong. And you know, it's pretty quaint if you somehow thought you had the "W" on this based on page numbers if you're only using something like a post-its.

Now to address your shit attitude; what really gets me is that, yes, Carlito, you & I get into it quite a bit. A lot of times, it seemed to stem from crit, or something I didn't think you were doing right. But you know what? I know, for a fact, like a broken record, I've explained how the site is about getting better & improving, like at least a THOUSAND times. Not beating other artists, but by becoming a better artist. You. As an individual. Taking what you do & do it better subsequently with each following battle. Learning. Progressing. Over three years of this! Even back when you were TRACING vagabond pages & people told me to lay off you because your profile said you were only 12 (be it typo or whatever).

So, for this to be some sort of HUGE revelation to you now, as if some rug was pulled out from under you? My god, just how FUCKING THICK are you?

Iketeruguy
Artist
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220 comments
# 44   Posted: May 12 2011, 04:10 PM
Carlito Quinones: I'm just telling you what I thought for the 3 years I been here. I read both fights I voted who beat who in each catagory. You asked for an explination of how I vote and that's it.
Quote

I think referring to the scoring process as voting is a problem.  I'm not picking on you at all; a lot of people refer to it that way.  I used to.  It's not an election though.  Like Qyzex said it's like Iron Chef or if you prefer it's like the Olympics or any other competition that people are judged on to win rather than simply scoring points like football or something.

I don't care how you score fights.  You can do whatever you want, but it's simply not true to say that people who score each side of a fight separately from the other one don't view this as a battle or a competition.  Olympic judges don't wait for all of the competitors to perform before they reveal their scores.  Each competitor is scored individually and the one with the highest score wins.  

If you or anyone else want to "vote" for your favorite fighter or fight or whatever by giving all 10's or all 0's to whoever you do or don't like, that's your prerogative.  I'm not even saying that's what you do; just if that's really how you wanted to score fights then go for it.  No one's stopping you.  Don't bash people for actually putting critical thought into the individual artistic efforts of the competitors though.

Dr.Salt
Artist
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90 comments
# 43   Posted: May 12 2011, 04:06 PM
Oh look, another Carlito drama. Boring.

William_Duel
Community Manager
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924 comments
# 42   Posted: May 12 2011, 02:26 PM
Hmhm while all this drama is going on I'm gonna crit poor Tommy here who I think is suffering the most while this is going on.  So mvm, page four is the strongest one here but it's absurdly different in quality.  I'm gonna guess you didn't have time to run it through PS or something.  Pages three and four that is.  I think since this is majorly in black and white that you should vary your linewidths so we can focus on the important figures in the scene.  It'll also add some depth.  I also see some issues with foreshortening.  Foreshortening is a hard subject but it's best understood by studying up on perspective and how figures fit into perspective.  Two books that I think are great on the subject is Andrew Loomis' figure drawing book (which has a section on such) and another book called Vanishing Point: Perspective in Comics.   This'll help you not only with foreshortening and the like but also with drawing backgrounds.  Unfortunately I haven't had too much time to study these things too indepth but the resources are there and it can be invaluable once you (or I) practice it.

Angie
Council
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1937 comments
# 41   Posted: May 12 2011, 01:35 PM
You said I do nothing but battle people that I won't lose to and should have lost verses fooray I don't know how that was supposed to be taken nicely. If you disagree with people that's fine, but don't try to drag people through the mud  for having a different opinion than you.

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 40   Posted: May 12 2011, 12:56 PM
I don't think that saying a professional level colorist with a huge fan following is gonna beat most people is an insult to those people... But okay.

Cracking Skulls
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344 comments
# 39   Posted: May 12 2011, 12:40 PM
Holy shit, Carlito.

Seriously.


Holy. Fucking. Shit.

Charlie
Artist
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726 comments
# 38   Posted: May 12 2011, 12:02 PM
Whoa man, now Pyras and I might not always see eye to eye but I gotta say that dig against him was rather low. I have seen Pyras show some improvement over the time he has been here, actually adding backgrounds etc among other things. I think that was a rather low blow man.

So if we're going to play that card : http://entervoid.com/comic.php?id=3362 I think looks a lot better in terms of line variation and detail than a lot of your current comics here. The lines are much cleaner and the detail is a lot better. I think if you really want to get better scores, if that is what this is all about, then put more time into it and try to polish it up. And I know you can do it, I've seen better Bullet comics out of you than Chia Hui by a landslide.

I also think grading battles based off previous work is exactly what should be happening here. Battles are here to help people improve, not become complacent with just being stuck in the same level they are at for however many years now. The fact that people take into account your previous comics should be keeping you on your toes, making you put out something better than what you have done before - something that you can feel proud of. Why churn out the same quality stuff over and over again with no effort to improve? It is just as much a competition against someone else as it is against yourself.

And I am sorry man, I just have to point this out - you've been here 3 years. The voting trends and patterns should be readily apparent to you. I've been here not as long and I've already picked up on how they work.

So dude, chill out please. You're going all crazy over this and attacking a bunch of people who have quite civilly placed their points on here.

Angie
Council
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1937 comments
# 37   Posted: May 12 2011, 11:04 AM
This won't be coherent as I'm on my phone but seriously carito, I was friendly and mature in my reply to you and you attack me and my opponents? You are an odd one. I primarily only battled my friends because I cared more about having a good time a d drawing with my friends than winning. Not all of us are like you where scores and wins are everything.

You Are personally attacking everyone because they have a different view than you which is a very childish way to handle a discussion I was not attacking you or your beliefs so please stop throwing dirt at me, pyras, or Anyone else that replies. I should not have to tell a grown man who from what I understand is in his 30s thus older than me that he needs to grow up and move on if a website is truly causing him so much emotional pain that he has to lash out at others who had no I'll intentions.

Again i was not attacking you but I am also not going to sit back and listen to you badmouth me, others, and my friends who I have battled just because we had different point of views. Please move on and away from this site because you are being destructive and are clearly just out to hurt others. Please grow up and enjoy making art elsewhere.

Qyzex
Artist
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670 comments
# 36   Posted: May 12 2011, 10:17 AM
Carlito, this site is just like Iron Chef. They're competing against each other, but they are scored individually in three different categories. They aren't compared to each other until the end, when the scoring is done. The higher score wins.

It is EXACTLY like Iron Chef, actually...

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 35   Posted: May 12 2011, 10:10 AM
Thanks for reading.


      Edited May 13 2011,  05:37 AM by carlito

Wei Ingnan
Artist
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597 comments
# 34   Posted: May 12 2011, 10:04 AM
mvm; nice first go...don't let all of carlito's crap ruin your first showing anymore than it already has....look forward to seeing more from you and watching you continue to develop...which contrary to what carlito thinks is what we are really about here.

Wei Ingnan
Artist
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597 comments
# 33   Posted: May 12 2011, 10:03 AM
Carlito; it boggles my mind that you can still have the same terrible fuckling atttitude that you had when you were first trying to join the site well over three years ago.
Is it so hard for you to comprehend that just because you think somthing works or looks good that others don't receive it that way?....it can't be me...it must be them....they don't like me....they don't know how to vote....people have said bad things about me and now they hate me.....3 years same goddamn song....sure you have gotten better slinging around bullshit to cover it up...but it always comes out in the end....your attitude sucks.

You should go...not only have you been going on and on about leaving for what?...a year and a half?......but this place obviously isn't doing anything to help you....and you and your hissy fits and your own questionable voting practices(and I ain't talking about voting philosophies either) are fucking it up for other people. I sincerely hope that the absence would assist you both as a person and as an artist in growing the fuck up already.





      Edited May 12 2011,  10:11 AM by Wei Ingnan

PyrasTerran
Community Manager
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1413 comments
# 32   Posted: May 12 2011, 10:02 AM
You don't need to get overly dramatic.. it's still a battle and a competition. But I think you're thinking too black and white on the subject. Doesn't it make sense to say that the person who has a great comic overall would also happen to have a better comic than his opponent? What does it really matter in what order you vote? You still get the same conclusion, don't you?

"I read this comic, I like it, voted. Read the second, oh I love it, voted. Alright, looks like #2 wins." = "I read both comics, I like the first but love the second.. voted. Alright, looks like #2 wins."

It's not like you're comparing apples and oranges, more like mandarins and tangerines.

You're looking so deep into this that you've mistaken what is really there. When it was said that "you're battling yourself as much as your opponent" or "the site is about your development more than battling" (paraphrasing), you're taking it way too literal. These aren't individual absolutes, they're all part of the entire quilt that is enterVoid.

Pyras, I think YOU are a perfect example of someone that grading against themself, doesn't benefit. You look at your first battle, you look at your last battle, nothing is different. I don't see you growing, changing, fluxuating at ALL.
Quote

Well, that sucks to hear, doesn't it. :(

      Edited May 12 2011,  10:05 AM by PyrasTerran

carlito
Artist
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375 comments
# 31   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:58 AM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:41 AM by carlito

carlito
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375 comments
# 30   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:55 AM
Thanks for reading.


      Edited May 13 2011,  05:41 AM by carlito

carlito
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375 comments
# 29   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:54 AM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:40 AM by carlito

carlito
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375 comments
# 28   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:51 AM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:49 AM by carlito

carlito
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375 comments
# 27   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:48 AM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:42 AM by carlito

carlito
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375 comments
# 26   Posted: May 12 2011, 09:41 AM
Thanks for reading.


      Edited May 13 2011,  05:44 AM by carlito

PyrasTerran
Community Manager
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1413 comments
# 25   Posted: May 12 2011, 06:05 AM
Honestly, I think ROFLQU hit it right, Carlito. Hell, everyone is right. You're taking the categories of comics and acting like they require different voting policies when not only do they not, but they shouldn't.

Even in a BB you have an opponent: Your previous work. Your grade from such a comic will reflect that. Even in a vs. collab you're competing with your opponent by trying to have the better half of the story.

No matter what way you slice it, there is a motivator factor or competitive element, and from the looks of it, most people (I would even go so far as to say the greater majority) vote in the same way: Taking each comic separately and voting on the sole quality of it. After that's done twice, you get two unbiased grades for two comics.

But you're free to explain how the voting system should exactly work for a vs. battle, and how your idea differs from everyone else's.

Angie
Council
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1937 comments
# 24   Posted: May 11 2011, 12:03 PM
Again, I am voting on the comics. If one comic was legitimately better than the other, the scores will reflect that. I'm not quite sure why you are getting hung up on my using the term BB, BBs have nothing to do with this, I used it to emphasize that my scores are based on the individual. I believe in being as unbiased as possible so that the artist is getting the scores that they themselves earned, I am not adjusting my scores just so Bob comes out ahead of George.

Maybe this will make more sense to you

I read comic A, I then give the comic all 5's because that's what I felt the comic deserved. I then read comic B, hey, this comic also deserved all 5's. If I felt both comics really deserved all 5's, why should I adjust the scores so that the comics are comparing to one another? I am giving you the artist what I felt deserved, your opponent does not change my opinion of your comic because your opponent did not draw your comic. I am giving you what YOU earned. Your opponent does not suddenly make me hate your comic or feel worst about it.

Sure, Void is a battling site. But both Galvo and Toast, the guys behind Void, have said we should be using Void how we want.

Guess what two things are far more important than winning, losing, scores, or ranks? Fun and learning. These battles seem to be stressing you out and all this focus on scores and winning seems to be giving you a rough time. If you are ultimately not having fun, there's no point in doing it. I mean no one's getting paid here, so there's no need to continue to get stressed and upset.

It may be healthy for you to just do one battle at a time or take a breather. Perhaps do some comics outside of any sort of competitive environment and see what you come up with. I personally gave up battling because it was no longer fun for me and I just didn't need any more stress, but I'm still doing comics for Void as well as outside of Void and that is what's fun for me. Some people thrive on the competition as a motivator and have a blast with tournies and fighting and that's fine too, they're not wrong for using the site differently than me as long as they're having fun doing it.

But between all the hate that's both come your way and come from you, it just doesn't look like you're really having fun anymore. Just chill and take a breather and do something for YOU without any focus on scores or winning or losing. You said you wanted to do a book right? Then go for it dude, the sky is the limit. See if doing a book gives you what you're looking for. And I'm not saying that to be all "omg gtfo Carlito" I'm saying it because I want you to be able to look at your past at Void a few years from now and be like "Void was a blast, I had a lot of fun and learned a lot" and not be like "I left Void forever because everyone's a douche and I hate everything".

Kuro
Artist
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581 comments
# 23   Posted: May 11 2011, 07:35 AM
Carlito Quinones: It's not about caring who wins. It's about who was better then who in each category.
Quote

No Carlito. It's about becoming better as an artist. You. Yourself.

All & all, when you break things down, the competition aspect of it all is incredibly arbitrary. Your opponent really doesn't figure into it at all, other than acting as a motivator for you to get your work done & being someone to share some fun with as you both aim to improve. Yet it's that competition that seems to be the part you concern yourself the most with. You're worrying more about the votes (& now even more feebly, worrying about the unbiased way people vote; & should vote) than worrying about giving us a quality comic that would nab you the precious high scores you apparently need so dearly.

I'll be back with proper crits later.

Cherubas
Artist
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175 comments
# 22   Posted: May 10 2011, 11:43 PM
Looks like either way Tommy is looking to be trained by Chia.

Carlito, it was an interesting idea and Tommy and his bear made me chuckle. The two main critiques I would offer on this comic are first: the background thing. I assume you were working on this at about the same time as your others, so I won't ride this point any further since you already know what I have to say. My second would be in regards to the one panel per page thing. If you had joined the site and only done comics this way, I'd probably ignore it by now and just write it off as your style. And if you do your next several comics like this I'll probably grow accustomed to it. But when I see an artist who typically does multi-panel pages resort to single panels, my mind instantly tries to figure out why. Are you parodying someone? Are we meant to hang on each dramatic moment? Is something amiss that we should catch? If I can't notice a legitimate reason that THIS comic in particular is built for one panel pages then it starts to feel like it's a cheap effort to make the comic seem longer. That may not be your intention, but I worry it comes off that way since this comic could be told in fewer pages and not lose anything (in my opinion). On a side note though, that's one sweet beard that Chia is rockin in this comic.

Mvm, you have some really nice use of blacks. I admire that, it happens to be a spot I fall short in. You also do a pretty good job mixing up the page layout and keeping things interesting. There are a few things I think you could improve on though. For one, some of your proportions seemed inconsistent. If you measure Tommy's head against his torso and hands and such in each frame you should quickly see what I mean. There were some minor grammar/spelling errors, be careful about that stuff. Maybe it's me, but in the second frame of the third page I find Tommy's reaction a little confusing. I think the body has a great pose that could be shock, a shrug, or a gleeful "tadaa" depending on the facial expression, but when I look to his face to clear it up for me it looks like RAGE! I don't feel like the pose and the expression are complimenting each other. You might also benefit from varying line thickness on your characters, making the lines thicker around edges of limbs and outlines and thinner for details like wrinkles in clothing, eyelids, and other little touches. The story was entertaining though, keep up the good work!

Charlie
Artist
icon
726 comments
# 21   Posted: May 10 2011, 11:24 PM
I think the reason for the lower scores might be Carlito not because of your attitude towards people, but this isn't really one of your better comics. Sorry to say bro but you're missing a lot in the backgrounds front. I couldn't even tell where the characters were for 99% of the comic due to them existing in a random white space. The lines also I think could use some work. You have these really thick looking lines everywhere that just don't look very smooth and because they're all nearly all the same line width it looks really flat - plus you miss out on being able to get a lot of fine details in there without making things muddy. Storywise I felt that this wasn't really one of your best either.

mvm - If I were you I'd try to get your words fitting in your text bubbles better. That is one thing I've noticed right off the bat with your comic is that things are off centered inside the bubbles or there isn't enough breathing room. It might be a personal preference, but this same advice was given to me and it just improved the overall look of my comics in terms of the way the words were presented. Everything becomes more readable and just more clean looking. I would also watch when you word things in the comic. I can't speak too much on that front because my writing is sloppy as fuck but some sentences read really awkward and could have maybe used some revising. I definitely liked that you had backgrounds in here as I generally knew where the characters were. The other thing I'd watch for is that pages 3 and 4 really threw me off because they didn't match the rest of the comic. You could simply adjust the levels and stuff in photoshop to make sure your blacks are actually black, just like the rest of your comic.

Overall it was an okay fight.

As for how I vote for comics it really depends. Generally I vote on them as if each comic was standalone and/or I base it off of previous works the artist has done. I take into consideration how much they have improved, the amount of time they have had to make their comic etc. The only time I really pit it against each other is if I find both comics to be super equal. I do not like to give equal scores if I can avoid it because I'd rather give the credit due to who did have a slight edge. But generally I vote based on each comic being standalone from the opponents, so very much like I would grade a BB.

My two cents on everything up to this point. No offense meant I'm just being honest in my critique + views on voting.

E.W. Schneider
Artist
icon
1055 comments
# 20   Posted: May 10 2011, 10:50 PM
I think you need to chill out a bit, Carlito. People are voting your comic and mvm's comic on its merit as it stands alone. In the end, people are voting the same there as they would based on everything you just said. It's an unbiased approach and really you end up the same either way.

Frustration about no comments is one thing, but there's no need to blow your top and swear off the site because of people voting a certain way. You're really talking semantics in your description there. I know BB is a four-letter word for some people on the site, but in this case it's working to your favor by having the votes be unbiased and based on the comic alone. It's better then if they were specifically cheating on either one of you, right? In the end, whoever made a better comic shows through the votes and how people graded them.

No critiques right now, but I thought it was rather funny how both of your comics compliment the other and work really well together, actually.

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 19   Posted: May 10 2011, 09:50 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:48 AM by carlito

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 18   Posted: May 10 2011, 09:18 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:43 AM by carlito

William_Duel
Community Manager
icon
924 comments
# 17   Posted: May 10 2011, 05:01 PM
angieness:
Carlito Quinones: Thanks. That's exactly what I wanted to know.

I'm confused by one thing though...
angieness: I treat each comic as though I'm voting on a BB and score individually instead of "well this person's entry was better so here's higher grades".
Quote
Why would you vote on it like it's a BB? It's not a BB, it's a BATTLE. One artist AGAINST the other. Which artist drew better? Which comic was more entertaining? Who's was more creative?
I'm pitting myself AGAINST that person (we all are when we do a standard battle) and you're voting like the other person isn't THERE?
Quote

Exactly :D that way I am voting as fairly as possible because I am voting based on the comics presented and not because I think one person or the other should win. I am voting on the comics, I don't care who wins.
Quote

Actually this is my standard for voting too.  I don't vote on who I think should win but rather how each person did individually.  And then when you pit those scores together they speak for themselves.  If I feel both people did equally then I may give them the same vote.

mvm
Artist
icon
18 comments
# 16   Posted: May 10 2011, 09:24 AM
Thanks for the crit angie ill try and work on my pacing and there will be a bb to come about the monster thanks

Angie
Council
icon
1937 comments
# 15   Posted: May 10 2011, 09:22 AM
Carlito Quinones: Thanks. That's exactly what I wanted to know.

I'm confused by one thing though...
angieness: I treat each comic as though I'm voting on a BB and score individually instead of "well this person's entry was better so here's higher grades".
Quote
Why would you vote on it like it's a BB? It's not a BB, it's a BATTLE. One artist AGAINST the other. Which artist drew better? Which comic was more entertaining? Who's was more creative?
I'm pitting myself AGAINST that person (we all are when we do a standard battle) and you're voting like the other person isn't THERE?
Quote

Exactly :D that way I am voting as fairly as possible because I am voting based on the comics presented and not because I think one person or the other should win. I am voting on the comics, I don't care who wins.

Darius Corry
Artist
icon
427 comments
# 14   Posted: May 10 2011, 09:03 AM
Well I can only speak for myself by saying I vote solely on if it the overall story was done in an effective manner refraining from any confusion or sense of "rush", no matter how unorthodox the approach is.

MVM, you lost me at the last couple of pages as to how Chai came into the concept, but I am intrigued to see Tommy evolve with Chai's training.

Carl, I get your slow pace sequence but I think more could've been put into the pages ( bgrounds and such). This could be due to the fact that you spoiled us with backgrounds in the past ( even with something as recent as you v. Coppermouth) and then you pitch out the straight-to-subject paneling that seems unfinished.

No beef here, my dude. The harsh reality is people have total freedom to vote for you based on personal dislike or genuine judgement of art, but remember you're here to showcase...scoring should almost be irrelevant to you if you're here to show us what you got.

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 13   Posted: May 10 2011, 08:52 AM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:46 AM by carlito

Angie
Council
icon
1937 comments
# 12   Posted: May 10 2011, 08:13 AM
PyrasTerran: Why exactly do people have to have hated it to rate it lower than the other? Perhaps I'm missing something
Quote

This. I rated the comics based on how I felt about each entry, not because of my feelings towards either artist (no one should ever EVER be voting based on how they feel about the artist or they're doing it wrong) or because I hated either comic. I treat each comic as though I'm voting on a BB and score individually instead of "well this person's entry was better so here's higher grades". Anywho..

Mvm-It's good that you started battling, I think this was a nice first effort. You did a nice job on the establishing shots and the expressions. The main thing I would work on right now is pacing and explaining things a little better. I was kind of confused by who the monster was on page 3 and where he came from. It may have helped to show that he was the thing in the beginning of the comic by either zooming out or having a page prior to it showing the monster was in a dream.

Carlito-While it's always good to experiment and try new things, part of experimenting is learning what works and what doesn't, so you're not going to always hit a home run. I think that the brush work overall worked well and you had some nice pages in there. But the thing that hurt the comic the most for me was it was kind of tedious to read. This was because this comic really could have been 5 pages long but you slaughtered your pacing by stretching it out in the 1 panel format across 20 pages. The extremely slow pacing made it difficult to get into which killed the entertainment score for me.  It also hurt you that across 20 giant panels, there was only 2 or 3 backgrounds so the comic appeared to take place in a white vortex of emptiness. The ending also felt unnecessary, the flashback came out of nowhere and felt forced.

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 11   Posted: May 10 2011, 07:49 AM
And Zsa answered that for me.

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 10   Posted: May 10 2011, 07:44 AM
PyrasTerran: Why exactly do people have to have hated it to rate it lower than the other? Perhaps I'm missing something
Quote


That's not what I was saying at all. It's mvm's first fight. So after 10 votes you could see he had 5.5, 5.4, 5.4. His scores have gone WAY up from that in the last 2 votes, but what I was asking was, Why I was scoring below 5's? Cause I could SEE I was.
I scored 5's and a 4 overall last round too, and I didn't even have an opponent! So I WASN'T saying why am I losing... I was saying what makes it so bad.

I really liked this fight, so I was asking where did I go wrong to get 4's and how do I remedy it? Could I get some crits or explaination why my past 2 or 3 fights suck so much more then EVERY fight I ever did before it, when I had thought this was a step in the right direction Art, Humor, pacing, and creative wise. Or can't I improve because it's a personal thing?

PyrasTerran
Community Manager
icon
1413 comments
# 9   Posted: May 10 2011, 12:06 AM
Why exactly do people have to have hated it to rate it lower than the other? Perhaps I'm missing something

Aluísio C. Santos
Artist
icon
735 comments
# 8   Posted: May 9 2011, 07:36 PM
Yup

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 7   Posted: May 9 2011, 12:23 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:45 AM by carlito

mvm
Artist
icon
18 comments
# 6   Posted: May 8 2011, 09:29 AM
man good stuff carlito I was laughing so hard when he said the bear protects me from the monsters crit coming soon

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 5   Posted: May 7 2011, 05:37 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:47 AM by carlito

mvm
Artist
icon
18 comments
# 4   Posted: May 6 2011, 01:13 PM
Thanks you too!

carlito
Artist
icon
375 comments
# 3   Posted: May 4 2011, 02:39 PM
Thanks for reading.

      Edited May 13 2011,  05:37 AM by carlito

Red
Council
icon
636 comments
# 2   Posted: Apr 22 2011, 04:54 PM
WHOA! I'm glad you're finally battling, mvm!! good luck!

E.W. Schneider
Artist
icon
1055 comments
# 1   Posted: Apr 17 2011, 04:01 AM
Hey, great to see you finally getting a battle mvm!

Good luck to the both of you.

Comic Details -

 
Drawing Time: 3 weeks
Ended: May 14th, 2011
Votes Cast: 28
Page Views: 1818
Winner: mvm
 

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