Invitational Tournament 2010: Round 2 / Whitcomb + Papillion vs. Veronika Roch

Invitational Tournament 2010: Round 2 / Whitcomb + Papillion vs. Veronika Roch

Invitational Tournament 2010: Round 2 — Whitcomb + Papillion vs. Veronika Roch

by mickequ

52.6%
771 points
Page 1Page 2Page 3Page 4Page 5

Crit level: No preference

by Sirius

47.4%
696 points
Page 1Page 2Page 3Page 4Page 5Page 6

Crit level: No preference



Critiques & Comments
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Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 27   Posted: Aug 22 2010, 07:39 PM
Thanks, Kuro.  IMO you always have the best, most accurate crits.  I still don't get the vertical compression thing though.  Maybe it's just my comics since I dont have as much time to refine each panel, but I don't see it in my normal works.  I dunno though, check out my sketchbook topic and see for yourself.  Anyways, looks like I'm gonna suffer a loss here.  No biggie, I plan to do some long-term battles very soon. :)

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 26   Posted: Aug 22 2010, 06:48 PM
Thanks kuro - yeah I was actually consciously trying to reduce the number of pages (although I can't remember why, seeing as I got the 6-pager from last round done okay) for this one, but I guess it really didn't turn out alright... I guess I shouldn't fight the urge to add that extra page and stretch it out next time, haha!

Kuro
Artist
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581 comments
# 25   Posted: Aug 22 2010, 08:41 AM
mickequ, it would have been nice to see this paced out over more pages. Like the same number of panels, same story, just not paced so quick & spread out more. It would have given you more room to draw so all the panels weren't super super tight & partly confusing. Otherwise, it was pretty damn cool. Sorry I didn't get much of a chance to weigh in on your first round match, I was saving it for last because I was anticipating big things & couldn't get back to it before voting ended. But I enjoyed that too.

sirius, figures are still stiff & the perspectives still just off or too convenient. I think you need to work on your observation more. Have a shot of someone walking? Look at someone walking or act it out yourself. And be natural if you do act it out. Have a long shot of the docks? look one up or go somewhere. And I'm not saying to copy exactly, but know that just because things taper towards the horizon, they're really never as stark as you have them. And still, all the faces are looking compressed vertically. Look into elevating your drawing surface. When you're inking, use the bigger stroked markers for fills. With things like the waves in the first panel, they're good to fill in the spots, but you have these broad ugly strokes for the edges & it looks sloppy. It's getting better, but you still need to keep working.

Shojin
Artist
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92 comments
# 24   Posted: Aug 19 2010, 09:30 PM
most of the critiques have been already given for this, so I won't repeat.

@ mickequ: I liked the story, it was really fun to read.  I'm really enjoying the style of your comic and characters.

@ Sirius:  I think you improved from the last comic. I think the stiffness mentioned by the others is because when you have some of the characters posed, they are posing but there isn't a great enough shift of weight.  Sometimes poses need to be exaggerated a little more than usual, not too much though.

Nice comics on both sides. I hope to see more from both of you. :D

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 23   Posted: Aug 19 2010, 07:18 AM
Haha yeah I figure it was out-of-character but it cracked me up for some reason having Tab hiring a hitman... sorry Mo :-P

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 22   Posted: Aug 18 2010, 09:18 PM
Derp. :-p

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 21   Posted: Aug 18 2010, 07:22 PM
You mean the Pico one?  What's funny is that I had a character (Plant-bird whatever) since before or around the same time as Pico the character.  Just so happens they basically have the same name, haha.  Anyways, if I can continue on in the tourney, you'll see more of Piko and learn more about him and Veronika.

Mo Rice
Artist
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14 comments
# 20   Posted: Aug 18 2010, 09:11 AM
Lol @ the cameo.

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 19   Posted: Aug 18 2010, 06:05 AM
Haha, sorry guys... other than the closeup thing, is there a way to easier differentiate characters?
and I'm glad I confused you enough for that to be your first comment, Tanalius...not to be annoying but can you tell me exactly what confused you/what to improve?

William_Duel
Community Manager
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924 comments
# 18   Posted: Aug 18 2010, 04:24 AM
Then I realized that I'd read the entire first page and thought it was Papillon, not Veronika.
Quote


Nice to know I'm not alone.  I'm going to echo that sentiment.  It was after reading it two or three times that it became clear to me that it was Veronika and not Papillon.

Tanalius
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1 comment
# 17   Posted: Aug 17 2010, 09:55 PM
I can't tell what the hell is going on in mikequs.

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 16   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 06:33 PM
Aww man Phil, I hate zooming out, then I have to draw BACKGROUNDS.
Sike, totally fair crit, thanks for the perspective man.


William_Duel
Community Manager
icon
924 comments
# 15   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 06:30 PM
Alright lemme give this a shot.  I went to a couple of figure drawing classes recently and it was a real eye opener.  For the first time, I understood the gravity and weight of the human body.  Whether I can make that translate in my own work is a different issue but that's where practice comes in.
There are three things I am observing in your work Sirius,
a) your bodies don't have that shifting weight
b) it looks like you're trying to scrunch the bodies into a small space
c) it's like you're trying to interpret them at two different angles at once.

Let's look at page one.  Part of this is the fact that the background is just wonky, that pier is at an angle and any normal person would slide right off it into the sea.  Which is what makes it seem as if your character doesn't have weight.  She's not shifting on either of her feet and she's walked at an angle opposing this slanted terrain.  Check out that line of action stuff that Orange linked, because the line of action also helps you determine weight and balance issues or at least I think they're interrelated.  As it is now, it seems like she's shifting on her back foot while walking forward but her back foot isn't completely flat.

Moving on, you often scrunch your shoulders too close to the body.  They're just so rigidly stuck to the body that you don't give them much range of movement.  
http://www.skinnytomuscle.net/shoulder_muscles.jpg
Aside from often having thick necks, you don't have enough of a trapezius muscle.  Even though you're drawing plenty of women give the shoulders a little room to move.  

Page 4, it's a good try at being dynamic but that arm swinging being papi is at a really painful angle to the rest of her body.  She might be a contortionist though so who knows?  It would probably make more sense to have that elbow fall below where her boob is at because of the angle.  And there's another issue, why are we seeing so much of that boob unless it's being spread to her side?  You're giving us a full view of the back, so we don't need to see that much of the front.  

Really, if you wanna simplify it, it's the arms, they're too small at times, too scrunched at times, the shoulders are on too tight.

Charlie
Artist
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726 comments
# 14   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 04:48 PM
Phil pretty much summed up my thoughts for the most part! Still enjoyable battles guys, though personally I think Sirius this is was an improvement over the last battle, but you could probably push the poses more.

http://johnkstuff.blogspot.com/2006/05/animation-school-lesson-5-line-of.html

This might help out a little! Its moreso the principles here rather than the style, I try to keep it in mind when doing my stuff as best as I can but just like everything...its a learning process. I mean this is personally the way I go about trying to think of my poses, then again I'm in a school for animation so go figure! Hope at least you can pick something out from this and research it further if you want and adapt the principles to your work :). Hope that helps some!

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 13   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 02:10 PM
Anyways, don't get me wrong, Phil.  I REALLY appreciate your crits and that you take the time to check out mine (And everyone's) new comics.  It's really cool.  I just need more detailed crits for the poses, 'cause I'm trying to improve them hardcore.

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 12   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 01:54 PM
I really don't get the stiffness thing.  I am honestly at a loss.  I did loosen the poses up, they're not even close to perfect, but I made a genuine effort to make some of the panels have some movement and I think I succeeded in some cases.  I need more than this crit everytime, I need specific examples or drawovers or somethin'.

Phill
Artist
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895 comments
# 11   Posted: Aug 16 2010, 01:45 PM
OK, hardass mode... ACTIVATE!!


Mickequ: I'm gonna be completely honest, I do not like how you're structuring your pages, with the word balloon placement and how characters are squeezed into their panels, it's hard to tell who is who and where they are at. You've set everything up so that everything is at a close up, with how you placed the word balloons, this leads to a very claustrophobic comic and me being ignorant here, I do not know who is who and what they're doing. Zoom out when you can, give your panels some breathing room.


Sirius: Not bad, although the art is a bit bland here, like... really boring. Your anatomy needs some serious work here as well, it's very stiff in some panels, and the characters shouldn't just stand ramrod stiff, loosen them up will ya? Story was OK, but it's the void standard so I can't really say much.


Even vote from me.

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 10   Posted: Aug 15 2010, 08:26 PM
I'M LOOKING FORWARD, YOU BETTER MAKE IT ON TIME

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 9   Posted: Aug 15 2010, 08:25 PM
Going to be submitting last minute, but trust me.  I'm going to submit on time.  LOOK FORWARD TO THIS!

mickequ
Artist
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26 comments
# 8   Posted: Aug 14 2010, 01:35 PM
Uploaded, and emailing thumbnails as I type. Hope you guys enjoy my comic; it was either this or Lady Gaga jokes about the "Poker Faces". :-P

Angie
Council
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1937 comments
# 7   Posted: Aug 14 2010, 10:11 AM
Good luck you guys! :D :D

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 6   Posted: Aug 13 2010, 08:11 PM
Needs moar hype.  Actually, most of these fights do. :/

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 5   Posted: Aug 9 2010, 08:11 PM
Woah I just had the sickest idea for a story.  It's kind of goofy, but kind of serious.  That's all I'll say, no more comments till the submission.

Zest
Artist
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141 comments
# 4   Posted: Aug 9 2010, 05:41 PM
This is gonna be rocking. Can't wait to see the outcome!

Sirius
Artist
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35 comments
# 3   Posted: Aug 9 2010, 09:18 AM
I'm going to do something of extremely high quality and of unexpected plot.  Look forward to it.

Cherubas
Artist
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175 comments
# 2   Posted: Aug 9 2010, 09:03 AM
This definitely has potential. I could see this as both a slasher flick and the plot to White Girls 2.

beardedMenace
Artist
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55 comments
# 1   Posted: Aug 9 2010, 05:30 AM
Haha, cannot wait to see the outcome of this one!  Good luck!

Comic Details -

 
Type: Tournament Match
Drawing Time: 1 week
Ended: Aug 22nd, 2010
Votes Cast: 36
Page Views: 1735
Winner: mickequ
 

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