STORMCROW- First off- wowza! are those some developed backgrounds I spy? I knew i was in for a treat the moment that opening page featured a lovely sculpture Hunter was pereched on. Very picturesque, if not a little Batman. Who doesn't love a little batman? Its clear you've taken alot of the advice given from your last comic and come into this battle guns blazing. The angles, and little things, like Heratik staring up at Hunter perched upon a sword are the little touches that make an otherwise bland scene carry weight and tension. I gotta say I love Hunters face on page 2 where Heratik tugs on his cape. I'm so used to you keeping your characters face rather static (too much botox..?), so its a great change to see an outright 'da fuq?' expression.
Honestly, I've got more praise that critique for this one. Its obvious you put alot of care into this brawl, and especially in those transformations from man to beast. Hunter's in particular was very nice. Digging that cracking of the amulets shade throughout before the full reveal on page 11. Your dynamic paneling also helped for this to look like some high stakes aerial acrobatics, though the biggest complaint I have while poring over your pages is how silent it is. These are big bad monsters laying into each other, drawing blood, laying waste to the city and exploding amulets betwixt their gnarly jaws. Seems almost impossible that there are no sound effects going on.
SYRAXIS- You know you're in for a dark time when a comic starts of with a Nietzsche quote. XD
As someone who's been following your void comics since you joined, I get the reference to Myra when Heratik says "i'm not a monster, she says I'm not", but someone just coming into your comics may not. Its good to ensure your comic can stand alone so it tells a fully understandable story, though sometimes that's not always possible. Still ,a quick flashback or something to indicate who or what Myra is may of helped?
Seems you also have the same problem as your opponent in that this epic battle turns into a silent film. Such great action and chilling monstery business and its dead quiet. Not even a rumble or the earth or crashing of glass. On page 11 are they just silently opening their mouths at each other?
Still though, I actually went back to your battle with Audrey to remind myself of who Myra is and its clear you've definitely come a long way between battles. It's a very promising sight.
Thank you everyone so much for the critiques, and sorry I've been delayed in responding but I'm here now so let's do this
@LanternLovers
[quote]
...I think my only critique for you is that in your next comics involving heavy action, is to make a mid transition scene where the characters are changing environments in a drastic way. For example, you could add an extra panel of Hunter picking up Heratik into the sky between pages 12 and 13... You could have also added a scenic panel where the sun was rising over the City Horizon to help reinforce the idea that the sun IS bad for Heratik...
I did actually have a page for that, I wound up cutting it out due to both time and I felt it wasn't completely necessary (now I see this wasn't the best choice though) and yes, I should have had a panel for the sunlight, I'll know for next time I do something like this. Thank you!
@Le Fred
[quote]
...Give us some better defined shadows or interaction with the surroundings, pay more attention to the angle you're looking at, and give us something a bit more solid than some coloured textures so it doesn't just look like these monsters are posing in front of a green screen...
That was something I got a bit worried about while making this, they stuck out in a way that I wasn't sure was good or bad, but I see what you mean. I still see myself as fairly new to comic making so I'm gonna have to experiment a bit more to see if I can fix it.
@PyrasTerran
[quote]
Your backgrounds suffer most from being so dark and like Stormcrow, without higher contrasts and stronger lighting sources your characters get lost in the black... If you're going to go with stylistic panels like with page 7, you should have taken in further; panel 4 of that same page would have been a great opportunity for a bright contrast background... All in all your shadows are too soft as well...
I will say, the edits you did definitely helped understand the contrast issues but yes my backgrounds need work. About the different styled panel, I was afraid that doing more would be considered either lazy or out of place, but I didn't think about things not showing up on the regular background. Similar to LeFred's critique, I'm gonna need to be working on getting backgrounds to compliment the characters instead of hiding them.
@Shen
[quote]
...work on people cuz Human Hunter's face looked a bit flat... This comic also could have benefited from more blood and carnage... Though I'm not entirely sure why Heratik stopped fighting and ran away at the end?...
I've always had issues with people and I'm still trying to work on it, just gonna need to practice more with them and get a better understanding of how light interacts with faces (I'm so bad at people I'm sorry). I agree though, I could have gone more violent, maybe something including loss of limbs and I'm honestly not sure why I didn't just draw them going ham on each other. About the end, Heratik is vulnerable to intense light, causing him and the assimilated feather to deteriorate, but like with Lantern's critique, I could have shown that better.
[quote]
With another monster thrown in the mix maybe >8D
FIGHT ME, FIGHT CROW, FIGHT US BOTH, AUGH MONSTER FIGHTSSSSS
(I apologize for the long string of comments but thank you everyone again for your advice)
This is amazing. I didn't realize how much I needed a giant monster battle until now. Everything I've wanted to mention has already been said, so lemme just say -- good job! I hope you two have a rematch because GIANT MONSTER BATTLES
@Shen
Oh my god, don't worry, not gonna kill you XD It sounds like all the crits on my half (and on my comics in general really, it's sort of a running theme) are really focusing in on
- more STUFF in the bkgs, more attention to detail and a lived-in feeling
- don't pull punches, go hard or go home when it comes to violence
- push effects and contrast to show interaction with the lighting and the environment
Just hearing it repeated helps drive it home, good to have these really sitting at the front of my brain for next time!
@Pyras
Oh god, yes please. I really want to see you and Heratik fight, since you've got that hot-and-cold feel going on, idk if poor Hunter could keep up with your beasties since I think he's the only one that can't significantly change his size or mass for his second form!
[quote]Or hey, maybe a future rematch between these guys, once both Sy and I have recovered from 'oh god so many teeth please no more' flashbacks XD
With another monster thrown in the mix maybe >8D
Since the other crits pretty much covered what I wanted to say- I will add this:
Syraxis you have improved so much! I had to check your archives to make sure of your comic count because I can't believe the improvement from vs Audrey to now. Like holy shit this looks so good. That cover is pretty rad too. You got some things to fix but I really wanted to say how great you've improved.
You both used your 5 weeks well- great job!
Everyone else did such a good job critiquing theres not much else I can add that hasn't already been said lol. To start, these are godamn AWESOME EPIC HOLY SHIT! Its so cool to just see some monsters rip-tearing into each other! That said, I think both of these could have pushed the rip-tearing a bit more. Im not sayin make a gore comic but i feel like these didnt have nearly enough blood to make the full impact of their teeth and claws and sharp bits.
Crow: This is so cinematic and illustrative! i love the composition and layout! i know you worked super duper hard on your backgrounds and it shows! ...although, and dont kill me, I do agree with LeFred that it doesnt look very lived-in. Its a fit of a flat, empty city. also is that the fucking personable spider on page 14 jesus christ XD the anatomy on the monsters is AMAZING and i love how you used the camera through this whole thing. But it still does kinda lack impact a bit. when they hit each other its hard to gauge how hard they struck. I really like Hunter's lineless red ribbons and how theyre just this gorgeous streak of movement across the page. Heratik's webbing looks awesome too but you never actually show it coming from Heratik, it just sort of starts appearing. Finally, plus a billion points for Hunter's Magical Boy Transformation but minus a billion points for Heratik not being sparkly~ lol
syraxis, i really love how you utilized your environment. the glass shards when they hit the windows and the gravel with Hunter his the floor looked awesome! But a lot of your backgrounds otherwise seemed kiiiinda empty, like whole pages at a time of just a texture. I loved your transformations, Hunter's awesome terrifying silhouette and Heratik's fuCKING FOOT SPLITTING APART, that shit is raw as fuck! your monsters are phenomenal but- and i know you know this cuz i heard you despairing about it- maybe a little work on people cuz Human Hunter's face looked a bit flat (i think his Magical Boy eyes were too big) This comic also could have benefited from more blood and carnage but yours looks a little more like it hurt at least. Though I'm not entirely sure why Heratik stopped fighting and ran away at the end? But i liked that shot of the infected feather.
You guys did soooo good, these are so cool! Congratulations, now take a break haha!
Pyras, thank you so much for the feedback! Especially for going above and beyond with leaving the visual aids as well, I know you've gotta be busy as fuck and the fact that you took the time is really kind of you.
I was a little confused by the higher-contrast comments at first, but after looking at the visual aid I definitely see what you mean-- adding more gloss to Hunter's feathers/fur when he's in his monster form would definitely help define the forms more, and rendering more in general is something I want to really focus on this year. I'll do my best to push the lighting and volume of figures in my next battle.
The effects you proposed really made a lot of a difference visually too, I'll do what I can to pump those up! After seeing Sy's side in its entirety I'm MAD jealous of his visual effects, especially the building-smash with the shattered glass and Epitome's 'hyper beam'. Interaction with the props and backgrounds would also probably help with my issue of overly static environments, so I'll work hard to keep that in mind!
And I definitely agree that I need to be less cautious with dealing damage. This fight in particular should have been an opportunity to go all-out, since both Hunter and Heratik can bounce back from some pretty heavy hits without much lasting effect, and in retrospect I do regard not going for it a bit harder. With luck--and with future opponent's permission, haha--I'll do my best to play less cautiously in future battles. Or hey, maybe a future rematch between these guys, once both Sy and I have recovered from 'oh god so many teeth please no more' flashbacks XD
Well folks
As a devoted kaiju fan above other fandoms this is pretty much my favorite battle of the year
And with both of you pulling 100% with your 5 weeks you deserve all the backpats and hurrahs
Even though this is just a classic Voiderus battle with little reason for conflict, you're able to capture the audience again with your battle, compositions and strong character work. What you both are lacking is attention to backgrounds, and better lighting to make your shots more powerful. Another twin critique: Because you both have characters with lots of blacks in them, you need to push the hilights/shadows/contrasts harder because both characters in both comics sometimes get lost in the darkness, their lines barely showing where some of their body parts are.
Stormcrow: You did good work with drawing out your backgrounds but since there's no variation in their shades it looks like the entire world was painted in the same shade of brownish gray. Rather than this overcast muddiness, consider going for a stronger color once the fight starts. It's okay to bring in colors outside the realm of reality when you're trying to evoke certain emotions. Warmer colors would have helped this battle. You should also add more light reflecting off Hunter's feathers, especially when you've established where the light source is coming from (like when he transforms and the light is coming from behind him), his back should have hilights, not the outlines of his feathers. This will help add 3-dimensionality to his wings. One thing your comic lacks that Syraxis' does is using the environment more to in combat, not just directly either; page 12 could have used clouds of dust pick up from Hunter's massive wings lifting him off into the air. On page 12 again, the last panel, we should have shards of brick fly off as Heratik pierces the wall with its legs. The silhouettes you use in later pages are too obvious because they're not dark enough; generally you just want the silhouette for hard blacks, whites, etc. so no one can see the lack of lines/details inside them. There are some moments like on page 14 and page 16 where it feels like you're missing a crucial panel to since sometimes it feels like actions happen right out of nowhere. Page 16 would be more impactful if we saw some of the vines in mid-anchorage, and if we had Hunter having to stop or course-correct from the surprise attack. Page 17 last panel was a perfect moment to really push some contrasts but you didn't take it; your hilights in general are too muted for the high octane action you want to convey. Pages 18 through 20 have great ferocity but again because of the muted shades and greys they're not as savage as they could be; you can also add alot more blood flying everywhere. The smashing to the ground could have used another panel or page to actually SHOW us the smashing; you're denying us the money shot blow! Another thing that is lacking in the conclusion is battle damage; even if these two are healers, it's okay to let us see some wounds for a while, given how much they've been ripping at each other. All in all be less conservative with your battles and just let it all loose; unleash your inner Studio Trigger
Syraxis: Your backgrounds suffer most from being so dark and like Stormcrow, without higher contrasts and stronger lighting sources your characters get lost in the black. Page 4 is particularly egregious with the last panel as Heratik's whole body is just floating in black, with no shadows to indicate the ground (asphalt goes grey after a while and light sources cause it to shine). Page 4 and 5 he eats this creature but a lack of blood really tames the otherwise horrific scenario. If you're going to go with stylistic panels like with page 7, you should have taken in further; panel 4 of that same page would have been a great opportunity for a bright contrast background like red to show all the tendrils that are reconnecting Heratik's head; the way it is now, so much is lost in black that all that hard work you put into this panel is wasted and unable to be appreciated. When it comes to the monster battle, you've got a better handle on how to maneuver the monsters and it helps, although again these dark dark backgrounds like in page 12 are not doing your work justice. There's a similar problem that Hunter had when you hit page 13, as they're suddenly up in the air when a moment ago they were on the ground. Consistency is crucial for an epic fight scene, the reader should never get lost with what is happening and where the fighters are. You've got this great setting with the lightning storm but you don't use it enough in moments when it could lead to some great panels. You did a fantastic job with the glass shattering, that's a great moment in your comic. But I had no idea what's happening at the end of page 14, how Hunter's character was attacked and ends up falling in page 15. It took me several looks between the two pages to realize that Heratik had bitten onto his arm. Alot of it again got lost in the darkness. All in all your shadows are too soft as well, especially with the abyssal beam, you want harder shadows that will definitely evoke greater power.
Really really great work you guys. And here is a link for you with some of my crappy visual notes to expand on some of my critique, I hope it helps you:
http://sta.sh/222vrkn41di7
Thank you so much for the feedback, Fred!
I agree with what you said about the font--originally I'd had it handwritten and made a last-minute shift to font for the sake of continuity with my other comics, but I think I liked the original handwritten versions better; if nothing else the text was a little more sharp-edged, and that would have suited things a bit more here.
For backgrounds, yeah, I definitely still need to work on them. They're still very much a weakness of mine--it's a consistent criticism that I've gotten in all of my comics so far--and while I think they're getting better a new problem seems to crop up each time; last time they were too featureless, this time it's the lack of props and clutter. Next time I'll hopefully have a bit lower of a page count, and I'll do my best to make sure the city feels inhabited.
I really appreciate the feedback, thank you so much (also thanks to you too, Lantern, though we've already screamed at each other over skype plenty, haha)!
Crow: Your sense of composition is really impressive, all the action flows neatly and dynamically, it's a pleasure to read these action sequences. I'm seriously impressed by that tight flow and those dramatic shots. Your words don't really mesh with the rest. for one, both text and bubble outline are thicker than your linework, and the font is a notch too jaunty to fit the very deliberate and clean work you've done. You backgrounds are, you know, acceptable. They do the job of having the fight happen somewhere, but it feels empty and dead. There are no cars in the streets, the ground is perfectly smooth and void of any trash, this is not a place where people live.
Syraxis: You're all about flare and effects, and in some places it works really well, like with that shattering glass and exploding ground, that's some tight shit. It's also the only times the characters feel at all connected with their environment instead of awkwardly floating over it which gives a a sizable blow to the intensity of the scene. Give us some better defined shadows or interaction with the surroundings, pay more attention to the angle you're looking at, and give us something a bit more solid than some coloured textures so it doesn't just look like these monsters are posing in front of a green screen, because the moments where you do those things right are seriously powerful man.
Both of you did really well though, all in all, a lot of effort can be seen in those pages.
Can I just say that the hype train has successfully choochoo'd all the way into HYPE CITY. Both of you have done absolutely wonderful in terms of pacing, color, and action. It is without a doubt that you poured your blood, sweat and tears into these pages, and damn, does it SHOW. Both of your comics give Heratik and Hunter equal screen time. While it looks like the winner of both comics - in the fight - is Heratik, the blows exchanged had me on edge on who would kill the other first. So if that was your goal, I think you guys got it spot on! Okay, what I'm getting here is that you guys did f$%&ing phenomenal action sequences! :P
Syraxis:The opening quote I'd say was a good touch to an epic fight. It really set the mood, and upon reread left me with another layer of characterization. I see you took into account Hunter's development while in Void City. The fact that Heratik gets enraged by being called a monster while fighting a monster-form of Hunter is ironic to me (on Hunter's part). Like I said before, I think you guys are both on par with how you handled fighting, but I think your transformation sequences is one of your strengths. From Hunter's "mask" being pulled off to both of our boys going into beast-mode. You did an excellent job.
I think my only critique for you is that in your next comics involving heavy action, is to make a mid transition scene where the characters are changing environments in a drastic way. For example, you could add an extra panel of Hunter picking up Heratik into the sky between pages 12 and 13. You did a great job in the transition where Heratik is being crushed into the building, and shatter glass is falling down with him as he slides to the ground. You could have also added a scenic panel where the sun was rising over the City Horizon to help reinforce the idea that the sun IS bad for Heratik. I hope what I said is applicable to you!
Stormcrow: Again, reiterating my opinion that you did some BOMB ass fight scenes.Syraxis' had a much more serious tone to his intro-dialogue. Yours had" a sort-of light-hearted intro into shit just got serious". That's not to say that yours was goofier, the moments where the comic took itself seriously was not over the top. I thought Heratik's inquisitiveness was very charming in your version of the fight. You layer on lighthearted moments with serious ones pretty effectively.
I would say your strength is that you really experimented with the perspective and angles with this scene. It definitely shows you were not afraid to go into three-point perspective. I especially liked that you drew a statue in the beginning, because all cities have flairs, and statues is a common thing to see. All your backgrounds had a personal touch to them! I'm not sure if this is a nitpick of mine, but aesthetically speaking, I think the transition from sepia/color tones into black/white/red could have transitioned better. I also think you paid a careful eye to your backgrounds. and the statue in the beginning of your comic was an excellent personalized touch for immersion.
This is probably just a nitpick, but between pages 13-17, you could have added a scene that showed Heratik shooting his webs into the frame of the buildings to trap Hunter. I think pages 18 and 19 portrayed the opposing forces of Hunter and Heratik great. Hope this is applicable!
edit: I also liked the pages of Heratik tasting delicious reaper blood and Hunter going "ohfuck". The emphasis on their expression lead into the fight pretty smoothly.
Alright, I think I'm all uploaded!
I'm sorry that there isn't more. Working on coms and school during parts of this battle got me a little messed up in terms of timeline, and I would have loved to have more pages but it wasn't to be. Sy, it's been an absolute pleasure working with you on this battle; I've had a ton of fun, and while we're both burned out as hell by this point I hope it was worth it for you as well. Can't wait until these pages post and we both get to see the full thing all laid out!
Thanks so much for the fight, man, I've had a blast :)
Omfg, I'm so excited. Thank god there's the five week option, Sy, drawing Heratik over and over in Epitome form is gonna MURDER ME. But I'm gonna do my best to make this a kickass battle, I'm so excited to see your half too!
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