J:   voodootattoon is my boy! we work in the same tattoo shop. he sees my shit & i c his shit b4 any of it gets uploaded, just 2 explain his comment. i didnt think it was worth the bother of posting it somewhere else. id b happy 2 email the battle in its entirity if youre still interested.

where r my manners,

i would much appreciate it VDT

hey Voodoo cn u let us know where you\'ve seen it? was it in the forums? under what?

and Pi?...I love you.

What a damn Shame. I actually got to read Kains comic in its entirety before I saw it posted on here and I can tell you guys that those 2 missing pages would have made quite a difference on this battle. Good work from you both. It seemed pretty even.

I don\'t mean to be insulting Pi... but in all honesty I do not think toast is going to bother reading this since he\'s oh so busy with his own personal matters such as keeping the site up and running. I know you\'ve got AIM so etiher talk to him there or PM him in the forums, don\'t add fuel to the fire now folks!

Dear toast,

Do you think it\'s productive to leave this guy (:points up:) on the site? I know you don\'t like turning anybody away, but I can see no benefit from letting him stay here. Even a site wide shun may not be enough, as I first suggested, which I now respectfully retract. It is of my opinion that nothing short of the most extreme action is necessary to deal with such a miscreant.

Humbly, TT

LoD i\'m sure you always talk like that when you have a cock in your mouth.

RBP: I agree with Zato with working on your movement lines and consistancy it\'ll help make your awsome coeography and...FINISH YOUR PGs!. Interactions with other character is good I mean it\'s a given the city is full of them but, make sure you work on dialouge so that you could nail other characters self expression to the tee, there\'s no harm in asking other creators what their character might or should, say or do in a certain situation. I\'d like to see more colors man to compliment your sketching your work is promising. Keep it up.

Kain: Sorry to hear about the page that didn\'t make it. You say it was your best then I believe you man, just impliment what you think is the best into everything you work on. It didn\'t seem like you pulled any punches on this one. And it also seemed as if you wanted to put a big subliminal \"FUCK YOU RBP!\" in your comic, dude you pulled it off. Next time tripple check every page is posted up I\'m sure you wanna show everything to us and your opponent and I wanna see it. good shit

Actually what would happen more accurately for his fur is based on the light in the environment. In this case, it\'s all based on color temperature; if a warm-tone light is on Kain, a cool-tone shade would be be cast (vice versa as well), and then the reflected light from his clothes would kick in at the edges. The biggest misunderstanding of shadows is that they\'re only one tone, when in fact, shadows have three parts to them; the core shadow (the shades produced naturally by curves or awkward surfaces, as in the shadow in the middle of a sphere), the form shadow (the shades produced by a direct cover from sunlight, as in the shadows on the bottom of your forearm), and the reflected light from any nearby surfaces. The tutorial here (http://www.itchstudios.com/psg/art_tut.htm) can explain it MUCH better than I can. Hopefully we\'ll be able to see some shades in your next comics, they\'d give your entries SO much more depth it\'ll probably jump your quality scores a few notches.

Now about the language issue, for those of you who were taken aback by the commentary on the content of the fight I do hope you understand that we\'re not at all bothered with his language or anything. It\'s really that the story had no DEPTH (even in its humor), and even if it WAS meant to be a shallow entry for pure violence, this comic was about as shallow as a MOUNTAIN. Phil\'s story had some form to it; there was an introduction, a conflict, a battle, and a resolution, where Kain\'s was six pages of \"HEY GUYS, I HATE REDBLOODPHIL\". If Kain chooses to script his character to be a bad-mouthing down-to-earth realistic talker, then by all means go ahead, but you also have to consider that if all we\'re gonna read in a Kain comic is \"FAGFAGFUCKIN\'FAGFUCKFUCKIN\'ASSHOLEFAG\" there\'s gotta be MORE to the comic than that. If all I wanted was to hear him cuss off for six pages I may as well just piss off the nearest guy I find on the street...and then run. There\'s just no DIRECTION the way it\'s written, and I don\'t very much enjoy reading a comic that goes nowhere. Phill\'s entry better demonstrated the understanding of the form of storytelling, and therefore he gets the vote for creativity and entertainment. It has NOTHING to do with the language or even if it was supposed to be funny, it\'s just that it didn\'t GO anywhere.

My advice for scripting comics is to see how well the plot reads out on paper, even if in only a few sentences. If it tells a coherent story, then it\'s worth putting into panels, but if the sentence comes out to \"The characters yell for a bit, then fight; Kain wins\", then it\'ll come out that bluntly in a comic as well.

Oh, and for the blue suggestion, it relates mostly to his cape since it wraps around his neck, if the cape is a shiney type of cloth (like latex or something) then it\'d reflect some blue light back in a way, that is unless it\'s like shirt fabric and just assorbs the light without giving off much of it\'s own. Same could be done for his orange suit, like maybe do that if he\'s in a very well lit room or there\'s light shining from under him while standing above a neon sign.

Color theory is crazy trust me.

Well, don\'t beat yourself up too much now, big pages is a common mistake (See kura\'s early battles with veronica nightingale) and as for the missing page... check out Mize vs ayako and Fluffbucket, you\'ll see a small one page gap in mize\'s half (yet, the thumb from that page was used oddly enough despite it being missing). So stuff like that is common. And I hear ya with not using that corney crap, it add personality to your character, the \"I\'m not afraid to speak my mind\" type, all you need to do is exploit it more and find a way to make it fit into a story and you\'re golden!

But yeah, another fight in the future should happen, and next time I\'ll be able to finish this time. As for now though... I\'m in the fight of my life with the Battle Royale, wish me luck folks... it\'s gonna be a doozy.

phil, i wish u left me a comment like this1 on the comment board when we initially started messaging, except 4 the fact that we probably wouldnt have even fought. u actually gave me suggestions on what, in YOUR opinion, would improve my art. its funny that u suggest shading kain\'s skin in a light blu, cuz im 1/2 way thru my robosockmonkey battle, & i used a silver shade 4 shadows.i just dont like 2 shade with black cuz if ya ask me, it subtracts from the brightness of my comic. although it seems 2 b what every1 in void wants 2 c, so i might do that a little in future fights. all in all, i think we both came up short on this. u didnt finish, & i was 4 sum reason missing a key page &  i uploaded it like a complete wad. so lets do it again sumtime! every1 seems 2 enter their hero, so i was contemplating entering a super-villian from my kain saga, perhaps we can rumble like that & i can focus more on unraveling a plot & not as much vengence blood & insuts.....we\'ll c.
........ya know i LOVE the comments left by the dudes that appreciate the offensiveness and explicity of my comic. not only do i think it enhances the entertainment value, but its more tru 2 life, ya know? any character created by kutthroat suspended over a vat of nuclear waste 4 example, wouldnt say \"untie me! you\'ll never get away with this!\" he\'d say, \"y\'all bitches best cut this rope or it\'ll b that ass! the last thing i wanted 2 do when creating kain was 2 make up sum nerdy-ass, super dork, so im not gonna have him talkin like an episode of frazier.
........again i apologize 4 the shity upload & the mystery missing page & i promise a clean finished product 4 the robosock battle, so b on the lookout 4 my man kain!

Man, reading these comments, I was actually expecting Kutthroat\'s comic to be offensive and in poor taste... and it wasn\'t.  Not at all.  I don\'t know why everyone\'s getting their pannies all caught in a knot.  It was pretty DAMN funny.  Especially the first couple of pages.  The only problem was that it took forever to load, but well worth it.  Good job, Kutthroat.

And, Phill, on your side.. Well, It started off fairly nice, but I couldn\'t really tell what was going on in the last 4 pages or so.  Also, I think the pages that were just inked looked a lot better... I enjoyed those the most.  I would go into how important it is to finish when you make such a big deal out of the fight, but you obviously already know that.

I\'d like to thank everybody for there vote, but I\'d also like to appologize for the quality of my fight... lazyness on my part mostly... plus some broken pens here and there.

Kutthroat: I\'m glad you didn\'t back down from me, but I must say, I could care less if you swear man (If I was against swearing in general... I\'d be the hypocryte of the year) in fact... I\'m pretty dirty myself in a way. I\'m sorry that we didn\'t get to know each other on better terms... Voodoo Tattoons says you\'re a good guy, but not too well versed in how online art communities work.

So, why not get to know everybody better and see how they work with there art on the forums... lots of information can be found there plus you can show off other works you may have done and get it critiqued. If possible ask voodoo about the AIM chats me and Hiemie host and maybe we could turn over a new leaf and get to know each other a bit better. But anywho, I\'m glad you didn\'t back down, your pencils look top notch, but maybe you could do a bit more with the shading... like for kain\'s whites use blue or some orange to show his suit is reflecting some light, junk and shit like that.

Anywho, keep it up or something?

thanx 4 the critique hobbes. im pretty pissed at myself 4 fuckin up my uploads. pretty much ruined any chance of winning all by myself. made worse by the fact my oppision didnt even finish, but oh-well. your opinions actually give me a place 2 go in my next fight instead of sum dumb-ass \"stop cussing\" comments. i can DEFINATELY appreciate that.
                   p.s. its not marker, its prismacolor pencils, but thanx again.            

To phil:
glad to see this finnaly finshed! nice work so far, but heres what i\'m seeing: first off, you would benefit greatly from alittl more blackspotting. the inks could be imporved, a little line variation and lighter touch on certain bits, but i can hardley talk, ink is my devil too. but blacksptooting, definatly bring it up a good notch.

also, what was said about keeping faces consistant, yes. that is a define need.

aside from that, your stoytelling is superb. and that\'s key, a comic without a story is just a bunch of pictures, no point. storytelling first. also, i\'m diggin the backgrounds. keeping  background and environment consistant and visible is a nescecity! good to see it here. and last: flow. that fact that you can lead the eye from panel topanel so well is greatly apriciated.  i wasn\'t confused or stuck anywere in the comic, the action and movment went from one into the other, good job.

all in all, good fight, a shame you couldn\'t finish inking the whole thing, but worth it for what i saw.

Kain:
a shame about the pages being too big, glad you said something, i was wondering if you knew how to use photoshop.

all in all, the art kicks ass. if i knew how to use markers like you do, i\'d be a happy camper. problem is, it\'s all pin-ups! the was no flow whatsoever from panel to panel, and eveyone was dead-center. that hurt the comic. and i have to agree waht people are saying: it would be totally excelent if for your next battle there was a story. or even a small narative, nothing big, but just a hook to hang the action on.
and personally, i have nothing agins foul laungue. but...WTF? yes, congradulations, your beautifull command of curse words makes you the fucking hemmingway of your generation. i commend you sir.

anyway, the color, the anatomy and the backgrounds are great, pick up the slack and you could seriously cause some damage.

As far as story goes, I have to give you props Phill.  You\'re trying to focus on story instead of just a battle.  Kain, you\'ve got alot to learn in that department apparently.  You had no story, no real development, just a \'I want you dead and let\'s fight.\'

Also, Kain...your writing is attrocious.  Please learn how to actually not just use 1337 speech and actually try to use that thing they call English.  Sorry, but making someone use 1337 speech won\'t degrade them in any way.  It just makes the artist look silly for attempting it.  Your comics seem to just be a way to improve your own self esteem.  

Artistically speaking, I think that Kain holds that one hands down.  Kain, you have some awesome style there.  I love the cartoon feel to both of your comics, but Kain...you surely hold the strength in that category.  As for you Phill....quantity does not make for quality.  Try and see if you can crack down and get those pages done.  

Creativity wise....I think that Phill takes that one.  Kain, your whole comic is nice, but I bet a third grader could come up with the basic concept you have.  \"This guy is stupid and silly...let\'s kill him.  Look at how strong I am in comparison.  LOL, you are so weak.\"  Seriously man, try and do more than that next time.  Phill, you try and do story, but yours can be a bit choppy at times.  Try to make it flow together just a little more.

Overall, I think you both did a fantastic job.  I know I can\'t draw as well as either of you.  I look forward to seeing more of both of your duels in the future.  Phill...try a few smaller page number contests.  See how those go maybe?  Kain...If you could really develop your stories, then you would truly be a fearsome foe to duel.  

Congrats to both of you.

Phill : I\'m sure you know most of your faults here. Needless to say I had to vote Kain slightly higher in quality for his finished work, but there\'s some other inconsistancies I\'m seeing in your work as well. You still seem to have a problem keeping your face shapes consistent, but it\'s looking more together here than it was in your fight with Mooo. I also notice that your motion lines look a bit too opaque to properly portray fast and forceful movements. You should look into perhaps making wide arcs or blurry lines from the moving object to portray a heavier and more dynamic velocity to your motions. Your script was an enjoyable read, although there was a few issues with your scripting that had me confused in the beginning; the focus just jumped from character to character and initially I couldn\'t tell who the comic was about. In the end I found your comic to be overall more entertaining, though.

Kain : Before I get to the dirt I\'ll just say that your markerwork still retains the quality of your previous work; that\'s not bad, but it\'s not very good either. I\'m still seeing no shade depths or color temperatures in your figures, and the similar pastel-like colors that everything has makes it hard to see the depth in your environment; granted, it\'s hard to do that kind of stuff with the natural media you prefer, but I\'d still like to see you pursue that. Otherwise, the quality is still just as good as your other comics, if not better.

Now in contrast to Phill\'s entry, for all the good things your comic\'s quality brings, it was a VERY unenjoyable read. The running gag wasn\'t even funny...it was tasteless, untactful and disrespectful. I know you were writing this out of a grudge, but PLEASE don\'t let that affect how you portray your opponent. We don\'t want to read about your hate, we want to see you produce a quality fight. The script and overall story was just horrible, and while your hand lettering is cleaner and more stylistic than Phill\'s, PLEASE consider how you word your dialogue (and I\'m NOT talking about profanity). People don\'t say \"U\" or \"2\" in real life, and it CERTAINLY isn\'t pleasant to find the irrational stupidity of internet lingo in comics (especially if it\'s not even in context). Like I said earlier, everything about this comic\'s script and premise is just untactful. I had to FORCE myself to read to the end of this comic, telling myself along the way \"Okay if this doesn\'t get any better by the end, I\'m bailing\". Next time, consider what your READERS will be seeing when you script your fights; remember that you\'re not the only one seeing this.

So by that fault, my vote goes to Phil for creativity and entertainment. I couldn\'t really trust the outcome of a battle out of spite to be top quality, but you\'ve both exceeded my expectations (good and bad).

Phil - not bad dude, sorry you couldn\'t get it finished.  The whole \"Hey I\'m Phil\" \"Hey I\'m Kure\" thing seemed sorta outta place, but whatever, at least your story made sense.

Kain - Dude...all I can say...is that I think you\'ve got artistic talent, and nice lettering.  Anything else, and I\'ll just start to cuss alot.

man i just gotta appologize 4 my half of this. i cant beleive im such a dumb ass. i shrunk all the pages down, saved them under a new name, then uploaded the huge originals. it sucks cuz i put alot of time into this battle 2. & the reason nobody knows why phil got electricuted is because a page is missing. but i loaded it!?! the screen said all the pages were uploaded 2 the server successfully or i would have tried 2 do it again, but i SWEAR i uploaded it. redblood swung his axe tail at kain on the 6th page & when kain ducks, the axe hits a circut breaker box and it fries him. it was probably my fuckin best page too, but i guess thats a mute point now. i dont know what happened. ....good battle phil.

Sorry, Kain~ I couldn\'t read your comic all the way through \'cause I was getting a headache from it\'s HUGENESS. D: But I love your style and I really hope this doesn\'t happen again.

Phil- your comic was quite entertaining. It\'s a shame it wasn\'t all inked, though. But still good none-the-less.

My vote goes to Phil simply \'cause I could get through his comic. Kain, better luck next time, man.

Kain.  That was the most boring comic I have ever seen.  If you\'re gonna fight here, leave your attitude and personal grudges at the door.  Mocking somone playfully is fine, but you have a vendetta and obviously you have no tact.  The only reason why I didnt score you all D\'s because you colored everything.  

Sorry, I\'m not zato... he\'s in another castle...

holy hell. Kain, i took off some points for your quality coz it was so fuckin\' huge. it think it was about a C...? the only reason i didn\'t vote \"crap\" is coz your art isn\'t bad at all. i took of entertainment points because i was getting pretty annoyed by scrolling all over my browser just to read your comic.
i think it would have been shitloads better if it was just sized down. and on a good note, your last page was just GENIOUS. i loved it. i don\'t have anything against you or your art, i voted as fairly as i could. can\'t wait to see improvements in your next battle!

phill, i thought you told me you FINISHED the battle?!?!  graaah  *beats you up*  oh well, it was still an enjoyment to read. the only problem i had was on the sketchy pages.....the text on them was kinda hard to read. that was my only problem.

good fight from both of you, but my points went to phill.

phil - wish you could\'ve finished, it was pretty entertaining from what I read. There\'s a lot of stiffness in your poses, maybe try some action or gesture studies?

kutthroat - don\'t forget to shrink your images. seriously, that\'s a pretty rookie error for you. Still, nice comic, but i didn\'t understand why phil was suddenly electrocuted? meh, not much of a fight scene, so you lost points on entertainment.

Ahh, grudge matches are fun.

Phill- Good job, but I was disappointed in seeing half the battle incomplete.  I know how that goes, though--but you gave us an enjoyable read, even without a fully-finished comic.  Art-wise, the only issues I had were Mize being pretty big--although he looks more feminine in this than the last time I saw him--and some stiff action panels, like when Phill lunges in to kick Kain in the dome.  You made up for that, though, with some slick choreography, like giving Kain a compound fracture in his right arm.  In terms of writing, I think you handled Kain well, and managed to throw in a few good cameos as well.

Kain- For Christ\'s sake, smaller files!  Crude, funny, and disrespectful as usual--but that\'s a style decision, and it\'s good to see you\'re keeping to your thing.  I say this because I\'m picky about this kind of thing--I don\'t really feel your action choreography, since it\'s basically just a punch, then shit-talk, followed by another punch, and then s\'more shit-talk.  Fights are one of two things--either they\'re over before you even knew they started, or these long, horrible, drawn-out slugfests where you\'re wondering when it\'s gonna end, and if anyone\'s gonna be alive afterward.  The fight just seemed too one-sided to me, and didn\'t have any real impact while I was reading it.  While I like the hand-lettering, I think it\'d be good to try other types of text balloons, as it would make the comic more interesting to read.

It\'s a shame that you didn\'t finish up with the inking Phillip, It was however fun to read
and the pages that werent inked still showed alot of detail!
you could have used alittle bigger text on some soundeffects though!

kutthroat your comic was a bit of a pain to read cause of the bigass pages, But the comic is well drawn and coloured also i like yer handwriting, but you really use to much the foul languge
for my taste!

Phil- Liked the comic and thanks for the cameo, its a shame you didnt manage to get it finished

Kutthroat- Im impressed, your comic was easier to follow and better drawn than your other stuff tho i am confused about the bit where phil gets electocuted

all in all gud battle from both youz

Finally uploaded... getting tired of looking at these pages. My only regret is that I couldn\'t finish inking... and the colors were looking awful when placed with the inks so sorry for the incomplete ness of the comic... but it is readable luckly. Hope you all like.

Boo ya!

yes....who do I think I am anyway...oh wait....I\'m the guy who\'s in charge of battles and extensions

kutthroat is still expected to submit on time

RedBloodPhil has purchased an extension cuz he is a PUSSY....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

3 pages left... and a over 18 pages left to ink! I might just call for an extention soon... Wish me luck guys and gals of void!

Oh my.  This really is just too much.  What will those wacky wacksters think of next?

o_o stupid grudge matches... cant we all just get along...er waith a min
CAT FIGHT!!!
wooooo

Man, this should have been a death match.. ULTIMATE VICTORY

If this turns into another YOURAFAGfest then I\'ve lost all hope for kutthroat. Otherwise, I hope this turns around and he starts LEARNING.

To that extent, I expect a loathesome and savage thrashing from you, Phill. *thumbsup*

Oh shit this battle going to be hot! Kutthroat don\'t default. Give Phil everything you got. GO KAIN GO!!

A furrie BATTLE! Fat Superhero Cat vs 6,5 foot tall Grey Cat, good luck guys with ya battles!

I hope the battle helps someone settle down and learn how to battle in Void well. Such a shame for such wonderful art to be.... wasted. Luck, Phil. ^_^

I\'m with Voodoo on this one.  Lessee if the smacktalkin gets backed up!  Though this\'d been crunk as a scar match.  Rock on Phil, Throw down KT, let the best cat win.

Alright from the comments i read on Kain vs Ka\'liara this is pretty much a blood match. Awesome. If Kain wins then we have a new shittalker on void who at least isnt afraid to back his words up in a fight. If Bad-blood Phil wins then Kain gets newbie smacked and a bad reputation. That being said this is a lil more than a standard match and im fuckin excited! No better way to settle a debate here on Void than a battle.  Rip eachothers throats out guys in the most humiliating ways possible!